The Free Dictionary  
mailing list For webmasters
Welcome Guest Forum Search | Active Topics | Members

Profile: Audiendus
About
User Name: Audiendus
Forum Rank: Advanced Member
Occupation:
Interests: Language, philosophy, music
Gender: Male
Home Page
Statistics
Joined: Wednesday, August 24, 2011
Last Visit: Thursday, March 21, 2019 11:14:41 AM
Number of Posts: 5,571
[0.60% of all post / 2.01 posts per day]
Avatar
  Last 10 Posts
Topic: Noun clauses and a noun clause beginning with 'that'
Posted: Thursday, March 21, 2019 11:13:52 AM
Drag0nspeaker wrote:
"that it is generally acceptable in modern British and American English" begins with the preposition 'that'. It appears to me to act like a noun in apposition to "insistence".

Yes, I agree. It could be called a complement to "insistence". It is not a relative clause.

Drag0nspeaker wrote:
b. "that has prolonged this thread" is not a relative clause anyway. It is the subject of the sentence in the dummy-subject form.

Yes. If we wish to make it the actual subject, we need to change it to: "What has prolonged this thread is..."

"That..." is a relative clause in the following example:

Your insistence that we are referring to has prolonged this thread.
Topic: Noun clauses and a noun clause beginning with 'that'
Posted: Thursday, March 21, 2019 10:05:23 AM
A cooperator wrote:
So, do you not think we can make
"It is your insistence that it is [generally acceptable in modern British and American English] which/that has prolonged this thread." into "That it is [generally acceptable in modern British and American English] is your insistence has prolonged this thread."?

No, that is ungrammatical and does not make sense. There are two finite verbs in the same clause (the second "is" and "has prolonged"). Also, we wish to say something about your insistence that it is [generally acceptable etc], so the words I have underlined need to be kept together.

A cooperator wrote:
"Your insistence that it is [generally acceptable in modern British and American English] has prolonged this thread." into "That it is [generally acceptable in modern British and American English] your insistence has prolonged this thread."

No, this does not make sense. The intended meaning is: It is your insistence that has prolonged this thread. The meaning is not: "that it is your insistence" (i.e. the fact that it is your insistence) that has prolonged this thread.

Also, if we include the words you have bracketed, we get:

That it is generally acceptable in modern British and American English your insistence has prolonged this thread.

Do you not agree that that is nonsensical?

Topic: Noun clauses and a noun clause beginning with 'that'
Posted: Thursday, March 21, 2019 9:30:35 AM
We commonly omit words where the meaning is clear from a previous sentence, e.g:

1. Is it true? Yes, it is.
2. I will tell you who did it. I did.
3. They said it wouldn't rain. However, it did.
4. I am not sure whether they are qualified. I think they are.

We may add 'that' clauses before and/or after the omitted words, e.g:

5. He was not there. His statement that he was is untrue.
6. Ghosts do not exist. But many people's belief that they do is very strong.
7. Ghosts do not exist. It is the belief that they do that is the problem.
Topic: Words forever
Posted: Wednesday, March 20, 2019 10:55:37 PM
rhombus
Topic: Noun clauses and a noun clause beginning with 'that'
Posted: Wednesday, March 20, 2019 10:47:50 PM
A cooperator wrote:
But, I have seen you made "It is your insistence that it is generally acceptable in modern British and American English which/that has prolonged this thread." into "Your insistence that it is generally acceptable in modern British and American English which/that has prolonged this thread."

The sentence:

Your insistence that it is [generally acceptable in modern British and American English] which/that has prolonged this thread

is ungrammatical, whether you include the bracketed words or not. It has no main clause – only two subordinate (dependent) clauses introduced by "that" and "which/that". The original sentence does have a main clause, i.e. "It is your insistence...". (The main verb of that sentence is the underlined "is", which does not appear in your revised sentence.) The following, however, would be acceptable:

Your insistence that it is has prolonged this thread.
Topic: Game with verbs
Posted: Tuesday, March 19, 2019 9:57:03 PM
typify
Topic: double consonant game.
Posted: Tuesday, March 19, 2019 9:51:24 PM
excommunicate
Topic: inversion + subjunctive
Posted: Tuesday, March 19, 2019 9:59:12 AM
Kirill Vorobyov wrote:
Audiendus wrote:
One fairly common expression using this construction is:

Perish the thought! (= May the thought perish!)

Does it mean "Forget this stupid thought" ?


http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/perish_the_thought

It seems there are two ways of looking at it:

1. Perish [transitive, imperative mood] the thought [object].

2. Perish [intransitive, subjunctive mood] the thought [subject].
Topic: inversion + subjunctive
Posted: Tuesday, March 19, 2019 9:40:02 AM
One fairly common expression using this construction is:

Perish the thought! (= May the thought perish!)
Topic: the antonym of the phrase 'modern medicine'
Posted: Monday, March 18, 2019 11:08:21 PM
Traditional medicine?

('Traditional' is often used in contrast to 'modern'.)

Main Forum RSS : RSS
Forum Terms and Guidelines | Privacy policy | Copyright © 2008-2019 Farlex, Inc. All rights reserved.