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pljames
Posted: Sunday, June 7, 2015 10:25:37 AM
Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 10/12/2013
Posts: 1,414
Neurons: 15,207
Location: Marble, North Carolina, United States
If Adam sinned, which was his personal sin, why do we have to suffer for his mistakes? He had the knowledge to know the difference and chose sin over righteousness, and asks the question why did he sin in the first place? ? Is there a personal sin not taking him into account and it comes down to personal knowledge alone. If our genetics are a mirror image of his, then his sin brought him and us genetic problems as well. I see Adam and Eve as individuals not our original parents. If one individual brakes the law not all of the other people are guilty.

They are charged as a individuals and not connected to any group except those who knowingly broke the law. Yet Adam and Eve broke the law and we all or found guilty. In John 3:16, ones belief in Jesus saves you. Right and wrong make sense to a point the point being Adam and Eve was not thinking of there offspring what were they thinking about when they sinned? Paul
Absinthius
Posted: Sunday, June 7, 2015 1:45:16 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 4/23/2015
Posts: 382
Neurons: 26,683
Location: Amsterdam, North Holland, Netherlands
pljames wrote:
If our genetics are a mirror image of his, then his sin brought him and us genetic problems as well.


This is not how genetics work, bible-babble is bad enough, keep genetics and science out of it.
Teluu
Posted: Sunday, June 7, 2015 2:53:01 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 5/23/2010
Posts: 378
Neurons: 1,412
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
What sin? These are all part of fear mongering! Christianity is founded upon these two stories from the Old Testament and the New, forming a religion unlike any other. Though human sacrifice to appease the Gods was a common basis for most ancient religions, the story of Adam and Eve adds a new twist:

Genesis Chapter 2:

“And the Lord God commanded the man, “You are free to eat from any tree in the garden; 17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die.”

Chapter 3:4:

“You will not surely die,” the serpent said to the woman. 5 “For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.” (sure the talking serpent myth)

22 And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil…”

In Romans 5:12, the doctrine of “sin” is introduced:

12 “Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned— ”

Yet, “sin” is not mentioned until Cain’s wrongdoing in Genesis 4:7! Before eating the apple, the first couple were naive and obedient just as children before they begin to mature. They were incapable of moral responsibility. So, their “sin” has nothing to do with morals or personal responsibility. It was invented in order to ground the human-god sacrifice of Jesus, because without sin, there can be no salvation.

By viewing human nature as sinful and ungodly, the way is made for the punishment hell provides. However, the story of the Fall wasn’t about that. The couple didn’t die when they ate the apple.

If we see Genesis as myth, it makes perfect sense. The story is an allegory about our dependence upon our parents, and the difficulties we must face to become mature adults. Rather than being the solution to life’s challenges, the Plan of Salvation exacerbates them. God’s intention to save the world becomes an utter failure when we consider that 99% of all life that ever existed is condemned and will be destroyed.
Dreamy
Posted: Sunday, June 7, 2015 6:26:44 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 9/11/2009
Posts: 1,501
Neurons: 10,806
Location: Hamilton, Waikato, New Zealand
Teluu wrote:
By viewing human nature as sinful and ungodly, the way is made for the punishment hell provides. However, the story of the Fall wasn’t about that. The couple didn’t die when they ate the apple.

I want to encourage you to do a bit more research into this subject, Teluu, because while you do show some knowledge of the Scriptures you make a couple of classic mistakes in your summation here.

The Book of Genesis is about beginnings, here are 10:

01. The beginning of Creation and Life.
02. The beginning of Humankind and Industry.
03. The beginning of Marriage and Family.
04. The beginning of History and Destiny.
05. The beginning of Deception and Temptation.
06. The beginning of Sin and Death
07. The beginning of Condemnation and Conflict.
08. The beginning of Salvation, Reconciliation, Sanctification, and Hope.
09. The beginning of Languages, Tribes, Nations and Governments.
10. The beginning of Mysteries and Revelations.

The forbidden fruit, not specified as an apple, but a source of knowledge, is at the very heart of the matter.

Until deception does its work and temptation proves its power, all is well in the Garden of Eden.

Once the forbidden fruit is taken its knowledge reveals the conflict between good and evil.

The death of innocence is an instant consequence of having the knowledge of good and evil.

The decay and death of physical matter is a proceeding consequence of having the knowledge of good and evil.

Have you seen Adam and Eve recently on a celebrity walk-about, or being interviewed on TV?

No. That's because just as forewarned they did in fact die, death being the consequence of their disobedience.

Teluu wrote:
The story is an allegory about our dependence upon our parents, and the difficulties we must face to become mature adults. Rather than being the solution to life’s challenges, the Plan of Salvation exacerbates them. God’s intention to save the world becomes an utter failure when we consider that 99% of all life that ever existed is condemned and will be destroyed.


How you arrive at this conclusion is symptomatic of the sinful nature.

1Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.



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