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When the tyrant has disposed of foreign enemies by conquest or treaty, and there is nothing more to fear from them, then he... Options
Daemon
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 12:00:00 AM
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When the tyrant has disposed of foreign enemies by conquest or treaty, and there is nothing more to fear from them, then he is always stirring up some war or other, in order that the people may require a leader.

Plato (427 BC-347 BC)
MechPebbles
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 1:21:52 AM

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This is not true for ancient Egypt's pharaohs at least according to the book The Rise and Fall of Ancient Egypt by Toby Wilkinson. The pharaohs fought wars to assert their influence in the areas south of Egypt (against the Kushites/Nubites) and in the north-east (against the Hittites and Asiatics) but once this was done, they preferred to spend all their time on huge building projects - palaces, temples and tombs.
Trivium_Discipulus
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 1:55:05 AM
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Daemon wrote:
When the tyrant has disposed of foreign enemies by conquest or treaty, and there is nothing more to fear from them, then he is always stirring up some war or other, in order that the people may require a leader.

Plato (427 BC-347 BC)


Do these self proclaimed "elites" that run society ever have to learn new tricks or do they just keep recycling the same old tricks over and over?
Bully_rus
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 2:42:28 AM
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Daemon wrote:
When the tyrant has disposed of foreign enemies by conquest or treaty, and there is nothing more to fear from them, then he is always stirring up some war or other, in order that the people may require a leader.

Plato (427 BC-347 BC)


The problem with tyrants is that they always want to take the place of God(s) even they don't have a faith in the upper forces. Fearmongering is just a tool of trade...
Alenka
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 2:48:02 AM
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Through the years it's always the same....
Alexander Ivanov
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 3:24:19 AM

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Plato was right
moniquester
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 3:59:47 AM

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Ah, dear brother Plato! You knew a lot about our times, even though you lived many moons ago! Wish we had heeded you long ago. But, alas! We did not. And therein lies our folly!
pedro
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 4:00:40 AM
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If you're a tyrant then it's not enough to quell your enemies abroad as you will always have plenty at home to worry about. Creating wars with other nations distracts your people from the fact that you are their enemy number one.
thar
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 4:45:25 AM

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To be fair, the meaning of 'tyrant' applied to Ancient Greece, and probably in this example, was not a judgement on their despotic behaviour, just on the system of government by one leader instead of the entrenched inaction of the old established families. That situation would probably be brought about by a war requiring a charismatic leader to take action.

Quote:

c.1300, "absolute ruler," especially one without legal right; "cruel, oppressive ruler," from Old French tiran, tyrant (12c.), from Latin tyrannus "lord, master, monarch, despot," especially "arbitrary ruler, cruel governor, autocrat" (source also of Spanish tirano, Italian tiranno), from Greek tyrannos "lord, master, sovereign, absolute ruler unlimited by law or constitution," a loan-word from a language of Asia Minor (probably Lydian); Klein compares Etruscan Turan "mistress, lady" (surname of Venus).
In the exact sense, a tyrant is an individual who arrogates to himself the royal authority without having a right to it. This is how the Greeks understood the word 'tyrant': they applied it indifferently to good and bad princes whose authority was not legitimate. [Rousseau, "The Social Contract"]
Originally in Greek the word was not applied to old hereditary sovereignties (basileiai) and despotic kings, but it was used of usurpers, even when popular, moderate, and just (such as Cypselus of Corinth), however it soon became a word of reproach in the usual modern sense. The spelling with -t arose in Old French by analogy with present participle endings in -ant. .
walirlan
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 5:28:06 AM

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True words. History is the proof of them.
Mark Brozik
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 7:19:20 AM

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As true today as it was then.
John J. Gerhardt
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 9:34:22 AM
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Topic is sameo-sameo today.
Milica Boghunovich
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 10:04:25 AM
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Plato clearly pointed out that those are the self-proclaimed "democrats", "republicans", communists and capitalists, etc., not "tyrants". Would we ever follow if they called themselves "tyrants"? The tactics of FEAR is their clever politics! Just look at where the concentration of money is! Their "POWER". Our planet Earth, a big ANIMAL FARM!
Milica Boghunovich
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 10:23:16 AM
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Milica Boghunovich wrote:
Plato clearly pointed out that those are the self-proclaimed "democrats", "republicans", communists and capitalists, etc., not "tyrants". Would we ever follow if they called themselves "tyrants"? The tactics of FEAR is their clever politics! Just look at where the concentration of money is! Their "POWER". Our planet Earth, a big ANIMAL FARM!


"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies in the final sense a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed."
Dwight D. Eisenhower

monamagda
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 11:52:00 AM

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The difference between a leader and a tyrant is that a leader works hard for the sake of everyone else, while a tyrant makes others work hard for him.
nkelsey
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 1:12:42 PM
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Well said Plato!
Jagadeesh Bangalore
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 1:27:06 PM

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Isn't modern politics a modified / evolved version of Plato's statement??
Only that modern politicians use high technology, media, etc., instead of swords & arrows.
And, alas! since their tools & modes are more refined because of high tech, and mostly not
with physical weapons, they can more easily slay or back stab others, who are less wary!! Not talking



Robert Imgrat
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 1:45:39 PM

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Tyranny is a sign of a mistrust to the people and a Nation, because through tyranny the People are deprived of their arms.
capitán
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 3:54:46 PM

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_When Napoleon fought in the French Revolution, he supposedly did it for the people.
Then, the french monarchy passed through the guillotine and the french people had their power.
Soon after the pretty short life of the french Directoire,
The existence of such government was overthrown by Napoleon
who was proclaimed the ¨Emperor¨ of the French Empire.
Soon afterwards, the french republic wasn't a republic after all, but an empire,
and Napoleon his dictator.

_The same happened in Latin America with Simón Bolivar.
He was there, watching history in the making, in the coronation of Napoleon.
He came back with ideas to America.
He fought in many wars and united Colomiba, Venezuela,
Ecuador, Panamá, Perú, Guyana and North West Brazil.
He was called ¨El Libertador¨ and in time, as Napoleon,
pretended to be the one in charge;
He pretended to be president for life.

_Now, I don´t want start talking about ¨freedom¨ and ¨independence¨
throughout the rest of Latin America, but what I ask is...

... what is the difference between a monarch, dictator, emperor or president for life?

Verbatim
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 6:59:24 PM
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Daemon wrote:
When the tyrant has disposed of foreign enemies by conquest or treaty, and there is nothing more to fear from them, then he is always stirring up some war or other, in order that the people may require a leader.

Plato (427 BC-347 BC)


If stirring up some war or other should fail, the tyrant makes himself the leader, one bent back at a time until nobody stands up.
When that stops working, the tyrant morphs into a demagogue to become a leader-- one bent ear at a time until nobody can hear anything else but his rhetoric.

Nothing is done to us without our co-operation, we are voluntary victims of tyranny, deceit, even of petty theft to which we contribute by closing our eyes.
BasiaB
Posted: Tuesday, August 5, 2014 11:04:21 PM
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True not only for tyrants but also for the US.
Verbatim
Posted: Wednesday, August 6, 2014 1:33:46 PM
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..."The tyrant... is always stirring up some war or other, in order that the people may require a leader."

When there is nothing more to fear from foreign enemies, they fear the "tyranny of the majority": The pretext to justify the prevailing of the minority.
Miriam...
Posted: Wednesday, August 6, 2014 7:05:02 PM

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I had to smile at Capitan's comment:
"... what is the difference between a monarch, dictator, emperor or president for life?"
I could never figure this out myself. And, after asking various people whom I thought were far more intelligent than I, to explain the differences--after studying dictionaries--it still was kind of a nebulous cloud inside my brain. I have always been troubled by this, since they all seem to be the same but only have a different name. I told my self that I was really going to have to get serious and study this enigma.:)
Verbatim
Posted: Wednesday, August 6, 2014 9:09:26 PM
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Depending on the perspective, we could add democracy to the list of 'makes no difference' among rulers mentioned by capitan. Smile:

In the words of Plato himself : "Democracy... is a charming form of government... dispensing a sort of equality to equals and unequals alike."
Bully_rus
Posted: Thursday, August 7, 2014 4:35:31 AM
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to Miriam...

The difference is the same as between mongrels and pedigrees. And some count that mongrels are more resilient in its capabilities.
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