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Why do non-Christians celebrate Christmas? Options
26letters
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 12:15:03 PM
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Why do some Atheists / Buddhists / Hindus / Jews / Shintoists celebrate Christmas?

If Christians are honoring Christ with the celebration of Christmas, why would non-Christians celebrate it?

What do they call it? Why that day? What customs do they observe? Do they still exchange gifts, decorate the home, have a holiday greeting, sing holiday songs, go to Christmas parties, etc.? What customs do they refuse to observe?

Does Christmas have meaning to non-Christians? How does this impact their lives the rest of the year?

(Come to think of it, these questions could also be asked of many Christians.)
Raparee
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 12:32:27 PM

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I would consider myself an agnostic more than anything (spiritual, not religious), but with leanings towards paganism/wicca/earth. For me, Christmas is a time to celebrate family and the fact that it was a "pagan" holiday stolen and adjusted for use by Christianity merely amuses me further. I have a Christmas tree and yep, we have an angel topper, but she's a very earthy angel in her own way. We give gifts to celebrate our family and make them smile and realize that even though we may not say it every day or week or even month, we do appreciate them. I don't generally care what I get, present-wise (so it's easy to surprise me), but I do try very hard to find special gifts for those I plan on giving gifts, something they will truly enjoy.

One of my gripes with the holiday concerns the carols. One, I can't STAND when all the radio stations play non-stop carols and nothing will turn me into a Grinch faster, especially when they start this BEFORE Thanksgiving. Thankfully, my rock station does NOT do this. But almost all classic carols are Christian-based. You rarely hear the non-Christian ones. Don't get me wrong, I like and sing a great many carols, but I'd like there to be some more non-traditional ones out there.

Pagan is quoted since in many ways, pagan simply means I follow a religion other than yours or specifically, non-Christian/Judaism/Islamic.
Irishfish
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 12:34:22 PM
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Your last statement is the first thing I thought of. As a Christian, I find that most of the current customs and practices of Christmas have little to do with Christ or the faith. While I do myself honor Christ during my own celebrations, I find that mainstream Christmas emphasizes almost everything except that.

I have a Muslim friend who comes to the Christmas party every year, wears the santa hat, exchanges gifts, puts up holiday decorations, sends greeting cards, and even sings Christmas songs. Every aspect of his "celebration" has absolutely nothing to do with Christianity, or Islam for that matter. And, everything goes so smoothly and is extremely non-hypocritical that it actually strikes me as to how un-Christian Christmas can be and still BE Christmas.

So, it is obvious to me that Christmas, having been tied in ancient times to several non-Christian/pagan rites, continues to allow participants to get out of it what they put into it...religion or not.
Montegofilms
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 1:20:14 PM
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I'm an atheist and I celebrate and love Christmas.

To answer all your questions I highly recommend watching the following 2 videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QciwB9FMTkc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_s9NWchEo8

Have a Merry Christmas!!! Angel
Winnie
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 1:55:06 PM
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Because most people find parties and celebrations fun, regardless of the excuse behind them.
MiTziGo
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 2:04:26 PM
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As a Jew, I have to say, it has never once crossed my mind to celebrate Christmas. In my view, doing so would be nothing short of blasphemy, since it is based on the premise that Jesus was a prophet, the son of God, God, and the Messiah. These are all things that Judaism firmly and unequivocally rejects.

For Muslims, I think this poses less of a problem, since they do accept Jesus as a prophet while rejecting the belief in his divine nature.

I would imagine that overall, non-Christians in the US (at least) may feel a certain peer pressure to join in the Christmas celebration. Here, it is such a major cultural experience, that there is no escaping it. Christmas decorations that used to be put on display over Thanksgiving weekend are now being advertised as early as Halloween, making the holiday an inescapable daily presence for months rather than weeks. When it comes down to it, there is something to be said for the "Christmas spirit" and the season of giving, and perhaps this is what non-Christians hold on to when they decide to participate in the holiday.

Also, keep in mind that just because I don't celebrate the holiday, this does not mean that I am entirely absent from it. I wish my friends a "Merry Christmas" when appropriate, I send their children Christmas presents, I go to Christmas parties and socialize and sit on Santa's lap (though more for the laughs than anything else, as I am way too old to be sitting on Santa). Doing all of these things does not mean that I am celebrating the holiday, I am merely being involved in my friends' cultural celebrations to the extent that it is appropriate for me. I would never consider going to a Christmas Mass, but then again, my Christian friends would not come with me to synagogue, though they happily indulge in latkes and jelly donuts at my Chanukah parties. Don't mistake acknowledging the holiday for celebrating it.
Nibbles
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 2:12:31 PM
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I wonder what Jesus would say about Christmas? Maybe something to the effect, "...hey people, that wasn't even the day I was born"?
NinjaMonkee
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 2:28:03 PM
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Winnie wrote:
Because most people find parties and celebrations fun, regardless of the excuse behind them.


I agree, along with commercialism
Raparee
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 2:38:18 PM

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This article was just on CNN and it's pretty interesting to see how different faiths merge what they want into the Christmas holiday or choose not to merge at all. I love seeing the trees up, but decorated with varying religious icons and ornaments. It's delightful to see them making something their own. That makes me feel good about people.

December Dilemma - courtesy of CNN

I also find it amusing they have dilemma, given the huge thread we have on dilemma vs dilemna.
Dreamy
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 3:00:06 PM

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As a Christian I don't mind who celebrates Christmas, I'm glad we do it near the end of the year, I rejoice in the redemption both of sinners and of pagan festival dates to serve Christian purposes, and as to why non-Christians celebrate Christmas I say "because they are welcome to!"
martyg
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 4:02:01 PM
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if you live in nyc, christmas starts with alternate side of the street parking rules cancelled. everything else is icing on the cake,
RuthP
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 4:06:59 PM

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Some background: Most cultures have a mid-winter celebration. (Wikipedia, winter solstice; look down the page for a partial holiday list.)
* It's been dark; it's about time for the light to start coming back;
* The world/sun has died and now it is returning;
* Related to above: we/my family/my clan have survived another year;
* Perishable food-stores are reaching the end of their shelf-live, use 'em or lose 'em;
* There is insufficient feed-stock for all the animals, reduce the population and feast at the same time;
* We're past harvest, not to planting, mending is done and there's not much to do- have a feast;

Mid-winter is one of the largest celebrations of the year; (planting/spring fertility and harvest would be the other big, shared-by-many-cultures festivals).

My point of view:
* I like seeing family and friends seldom seen the rest of the year;
* I like the tradition of charity to strangers as well as at home;
* What's not to like about food and drink?
* I like giving to my commmunity;
* I like seeing people I don't know going down the street wreathed in smiles;
* I like "Christmas" trees (thank you pagan German tradition);
* I like "Christmas" lights (the sun is coming back);
* I like the music, both secular and religious (went caroling with neighbors last weekend);
* My neighbor next door, across the street, up the hill and across town are celebrating Christmas- I'll wish them a Merry Christmas;
* My other cross-town friend and two co-workers celebrated Hanuka/Hanukkah/Chanuka (transliteration is tough)- I wished them Happy Hanukkah;
* Given all the mid-winter celebrations, I can pretty safely wish anyone a Happy Holidays;
* My job gives me a holiday on Christmas (though some of us will work, I have it off this year)

I hope my list gave some feeling of what I mean. People of all cultures and all beliefs hold to these same ideals. I celebrate much of the philosophy of the season and I generally call it Christmas, because that is the culture which overwhelmingly surrounds me where I live.

Merry Christmas, with all my heart, to those who celebrate. Equally heart-felt Happy Holiday (of your choice) to those of other traditions. I hold all of my friends on the Forum in my heart and wish you all the best in the New Year, too.
RuthP
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 4:08:02 PM

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Dreamy wrote:
As a Christian I don't mind who celebrates Christmas, I'm glad we do it near the end of the year, I rejoice in the redemption both of sinners and of pagan festival dates to serve Christian purposes, and as to why non-Christians celebrate Christmas I say "because they are welcome to!"


See, this is the best of the season. Thanks, Dreamy!
gatodepatasblancas
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 4:18:39 PM
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Please think about the spirit, the drive of the people enjoying this celebration.

In this day and age, Christmas is more than the celebration of the birth of the greatest of the teachers (and no, I'm not catholic, nor christian; I'm more like a cientific believer, that's why I think of Jesus as a teacher, the greatest). If you love your family, wives, husbands, daughters, sons, grandfathers, grandmothers, and everyone, this season is to make your loves ones happy, to see the delighted faces of the children when they open a gift. The lovely eyes of your wife (in my case) whe she open a box and find the gift of my heart.

THAT is Christmas. The gifts are not important, only the feelings.

They shun Christmas for because their religion? Their loss, because the joy don't belong to the religion, tha happiness belongs to human beings.

By the way... Merry christmas!! Happy new year 2010!! And I don't care about your beliefs!! I care about you as a person!!
Maggie
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 6:20:30 PM
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[quote=MichalG]As a Jew, I have to say, it has never once crossed my mind to celebrate Christmas. In my view, doing so would be nothing short of blasphemy, since it is based on the premise that Jesus was a prophet, the son of God, God, and the Messiah. These are all things that Judaism firmly and unequivocally rejects.

For Muslims, I think this poses less of a problem, since they do accept Jesus as a prophet while rejecting the belief in his divine nature.

Also, keep in mind that just because I don't celebrate the holiday, this does not mean that I am entirely absent from it. I wish my friends a "Merry Christmas" when appropriate, I send their children Christmas presents, I go to Christmas parties and socialize and sit on Santa's lap (though more for the laughs than anything else, as I am way too old to be sitting on Santa).

Christians and Jews have a tremendous amount of things in common. But first and foremost, we honor the SAME God. And the Christmas season does overlap with the Jewish holiday Hanukkah. Because the season is a holy holiday, regardless of one's faith, I hope all my friends - Christian, Jewish, and otherwise - will accept the genuineness of my greeting to all:
I do wish each of you a VERY Merry Christmas and a happy new year.
abcxyz
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 7:00:20 PM
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Winnie wrote:
Because most people find parties and celebrations fun, regardless of the excuse behind them.

Absolutely. Applause
Quote:
Why do some Atheists / Buddhists / Hindus / Jews / Shintoists celebrate Christmas?

If Christians are honoring Christ with the celebration of Christmas, why would non-Christians celebrate it?

What do they call it? Why that day? What customs do they observe? Do they still exchange gifts, decorate the home, have a holiday greeting, sing holiday songs, go to Christmas parties, etc.? What customs do they refuse to observe?

Does Christmas have meaning to non-Christians? How does this impact their lives the rest of the year?

(Come to think of it, these questions could also be asked of many Christians.)

I'm a Hindu by birth and an atheist by beliefs, so I don't celebrate X-mas to honour anyone.

Speaking for myself, I don't send gifts unless somebody sends me a gift (then I send that person a gift), don't decorate my home, greet people all the same and sing whatever I feel like singing. I don't do what I don't do not because Christians do those. I just don't find them fun.
X-mas means holiday, and who doesn't love holidays? Talking about impact, no, it doesn't have any impact on me. I like those X-mas decorations and cakes, that's all.

Wish you all a merry Christmas and a happy new year.
nooblet
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 8:33:00 PM
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As others have mentioned, Christmas is really just a German pagan holiday in disguise so pagans would more easily convert to Christianity.

With that said, I believe it was Dreamy who posted (in another thread) about Saint Nicholas and how he did a lot of good for others. The story which started the whole Santa Claus story, though, has to do with a poor man who could not afford dowry for his three daughters, so their future was bleak (and they would probably end up prostitutes). Saint Nicholas, under the cover of night, went and threw a purse of gold through an opening in the man's window for each of his daughters, so that they could be married and saved from a fate of prostitution.

Anyway, I believe very much in the spirit of what Saint Nicholas did, regardless of my faith. Charity, gift-giving, or whatever you want to call it has a way of making people feel really good. I know that I tend to spend a lot of time thinking up gifts that my friends and loved ones will really enjoy, and I love seeing their faces light up when they see what they've gotten. But I also like donating a few things to charities as well, because when I was a kid there were a lot of things that my family could not afford and it was sometimes through the charity of others that we made it through tough times. This is why I celebrate Christmas.
sandraleesmith46
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 10:29:29 PM
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Wow, not much to say here. It's been well covered, I'd say. I'll only add that for those celebrating Jesus' birth, the Passover/Easter season is closer to it, according to the latest calculations which place it about 17April, 6BCE. But that's okay, if you want to celebrate it at Saturnalia or whichever of the Druid holidays they celebrated at mid-winter. I think RuthP came closest to what I celebrate about the holiday season, when I celebrate at all. That said, I'll just wish all of you here at TFD a very happy holiday season to celebrate however seems best to each of you, and look forward to continuing our sharing in the New Year.
Srividhya
Posted: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 10:51:00 PM
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I'm a Hindu by birth, and belong to an orthodox Hindu family.
We decorate our house with a star at least 10 days before Christmas, because we also believe that Jesus is God and his birth calls for a celebration (just as we celebrate the birth of Lord Krishna).

On Christmas day, which is usually a holiday, we buy some Christmas cakes, eat them may be go out, wish some Christian friends and visit their homes, if invited.

Merry Christmas!!
Geeman
Posted: Thursday, December 24, 2009 2:56:57 AM

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26letters wrote:
If Christians are honoring Christ with the celebration of Christmas, why would non-Christians celebrate it?

Two words:
Egg.
Nog.


About the only thing I really care about Christmas anymore is that they start selling that diabetic sludge at the supermarket. You know, the stuff that's thicker than blood and has all the wholesome nutritional content of milk and eggs completely destroyed by enough sugar to kill a buffalo. It's the annual sugar buzz that I like. If it weren't associated with the holiday, I'm pretty sure it'd be classified as a Schedule 1 controlled substance.

I don't bother with showing up at my relatives' houses on Christmas anymore. Know why? No nog. It's as simple as that. If they had the @#%!ing sense to serve up a few quarts of the stuff then I'd show up, but they just haven't figured that out. So, screw 'em. No nog, no me. Jam the mistletoe up the collective chimney, family. If you don't serve up some nog then you're all dead to me.

And none of that "home made" stuff either. It has to be the industrially produced toxic nightmare. Spiking it with some alcohol (which is like taking a valium to "smooth out" the meth...) is the only "recipe" that should be associated with egg nog. I don't even know if there's real milk or eggs in that stuff. It could be produced by "Milk Substitute Unit 237B" and "Bacterial Egg Culture Extract #4." I don't care. Just rip that mass-produced carton open and pour, Santa-baby, and if you see me empty then hit it again. No need to ask if I want a refill. That's the only way I can make it through the silly season these days.

Egg nog is the only justification I can see for living on life support after a catastrophic head injury. If one of those tubes feeds me nog then I'm down with all the machinery keeping my vegetative meatsack going as long as possible. In fact, that sounds like a pretty good way to celebrate the holidays. I wonder where I can pick up one of those drip bag on wheels thingies they always have on TV hospital dramas? I bet I can DIY something out of an old luggage rack and some PVC pipe....

Well, now that I've got a project for the weekend: Have a Merry Christmas and a Happy Nog Day to both the godless heathens and the Jesus junkies. Don't let the holiday smash you in the face. Sit back. Relax. Have some nog.
yassou
Posted: Thursday, December 24, 2009 10:27:36 AM
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I am a Muslim. Every year I celebrate Christmas with my christian friends. I like the "christmas spirit" and the festivities. I would like to add that Muslims praise Jesus and Mariam and believe in the Same God of Jews and Christians. Thus in my opinion it is obvious why Muslims -except those blinded by hatred- like to celebrate Christmas.
MiTziGo
Posted: Thursday, December 24, 2009 11:20:50 AM
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martyg wrote:
if you live in nyc, christmas starts with alternate side of the street parking rules cancelled. everything else is icing on the cake,

It's not suspended till tomorrow!!! Quick, get out and move your car!

People never realize that Christmas Eve is not suspended and the meter maids have a field day. I guess for them, Christmas really does come early!
Epiphileon
Posted: Thursday, December 24, 2009 1:52:33 PM

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I know it has been alluded to, but I feel the real question here would be, "Why do Christians celebrate winter solstice?
The same question could be asked of spring equinox.
If I recall correctly the idea of placing these two holidays where they are in the year, to keep Christians away from the usually hedonistic pagan rituals, has some merit.

Although I am a non-theist I have no problem celebrating Christmas, even as representing the birth of Christ. The advent of Christianity marked a major developmental leap in religion, and consciousness. Not only did the locus of control move to an internal one, but love and compassion were the primary emphasis.
risadr
Posted: Thursday, December 24, 2009 2:56:54 PM
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I consider myself a Universal Spiritualist. I don't believe in or belong to any organized religion.

When I celebrate Christmas (and Chanukah, for that matter) it's about togetherness and being with family to enjoy the company and the loving feelings and the goodness that the holidays bring about. I, personally, feel this way about my family and friends all year, but it comes out best during the winter holiday season.
NinjaMonkee
Posted: Thursday, December 24, 2009 3:50:12 PM
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Christmas is so much more than Jesus's birthday. Its about being with family, friends, love, and togetherness. All of humanity should celebrate in one sense or another.
Mrbazoun
Posted: Thursday, December 24, 2009 9:28:43 PM
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yassou wrote:
I am a Muslim. Every year I celebrate Christmas with my christian friends. I like the "christmas spirit" and the festivities. I would like to add that Muslims praise Jesus and Mariam and believe in the Same God of Jews and Christians. Thus in my opinion it is obvious why Muslims -except those blinded by hatred- like to celebrate Christmas.


I'm sorry but your last sentence is very puzzling to me. Can you clarify? Would you say that all Muslims who aren't blinded by hatred celebrate Christmas? I'm a Muslim, I'm not blinded by hatred, yet I do not celebrate Christmas. I am going to a Christmas party in a bit, but my family isn't exchanging gifts.
yassou
Posted: Friday, December 25, 2009 3:53:00 AM
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Mrbazoun wrote:
yassou wrote:
I am a Muslim. Every year I celebrate Christmas with my christian friends. I like the "christmas spirit" and the festivities. I would like to add that Muslims praise Jesus and Mariam and believe in the Same God of Jews and Christians. Thus in my opinion it is obvious why Muslims -except those blinded by hatred- like to celebrate Christmas.


I'm sorry but your last sentence is very puzzling to me. Can you clarify? Would you say that all Muslims who aren't blinded by hatred celebrate Christmas? I'm a Muslim, I'm not blinded by hatred, yet I do not celebrate Christmas. I am going to a Christmas party in a bit, but my family isn't exchanging gifts.


Hey, by celebrating Christmas I meant "sharing" with Christians (their joy going to parties for example). We do not exchange gifts in my family. The "blinded by hatred" get easily offended and treat you as an infidel Anxious when they hear you say "Merry Christmas". You might know well that these people do exist. In brief, it's all about empathy.
kisholoy mukherjee
Posted: Friday, December 25, 2009 6:04:47 AM
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yassou wrote:
Mrbazoun wrote:
yassou wrote:
I am a Muslim. Every year I celebrate Christmas with my christian friends. I like the "christmas spirit" and the festivities. I would like to add that Muslims praise Jesus and Mariam and believe in the Same God of Jews and Christians. Thus in my opinion it is obvious why Muslims -except those blinded by hatred- like to celebrate Christmas.


I'm sorry but your last sentence is very puzzling to me. Can you clarify? Would you say that all Muslims who aren't blinded by hatred celebrate Christmas? I'm a Muslim, I'm not blinded by hatred, yet I do not celebrate Christmas. I am going to a Christmas party in a bit, but my family isn't exchanging gifts.


Hey, by celebrating Christmas I meant "sharing" with Christians (their joy going to parties for example). We do not exchange gifts in my family. The "blinded by hatred" get easily offended and treat you as an infidel Anxious when they hear you say "Merry Christmas". You might know well that these people do exist. In brief, it's all about empathy.


I can understand what you mean and i support your points. I think irrespective of religion, one can celebrate christmas and any other occassion since its only a celebration of life with kindness, love, care and humanity towards all. If these are the basic elements of anything, then it is only for the good.

Mrbazoun, I think you misinterpreted yassou. Yassou didn't say every muslim (or non-christian) who don't harbour hatred celebrate christmas. But obviously those who do, cannot or maybe won't celebrate it don't you agree??
kisholoy mukherjee
Posted: Friday, December 25, 2009 6:05:37 AM
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risadr wrote:
I consider myself a Universal Spiritualist. I don't believe in or belong to any organized religion.

When I celebrate Christmas (and Chanukah, for that matter) it's about togetherness and being with family to enjoy the company and the loving feelings and the goodness that the holidays bring about. I, personally, feel this way about my family and friends all year, but it comes out best during the winter holiday season.


Applause
yassou
Posted: Friday, December 25, 2009 11:06:23 AM
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kisholoy mukherjee wrote:


Mrbazoun, I think you misinterpreted yassou. Yassou didn't say every muslim (or non-christian) who don't harbour hatred celebrate christmas. But obviously those who do, cannot or maybe won't celebrate it don't you agree??


^_^ Thank you kisholoy mukherjee. You got the point of my message.
26letters
Posted: Saturday, December 26, 2009 11:31:02 PM
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These have been some very interesting comments. It helped me realize that trying to live up to the standard that Christ set elevates people - it makes them the best that they can possibly be. People have shown themselves to be good-hearted, generous, happy, forgiving, etc. - all because that's the kind of person a Christian should be.

Even those who do not profess a belief in Christ find themselves displaying an elevated standard of humanity in their efforts to improve someone else's lot in life. There truly is no better thing than to give. Christ himself said, "There is more happiness in giving than there is in receiving."

The one question that didn't seem to be considered has to do with how this one day impacts the rest of your life. Does it change you? Do you find yourself still of the same happy, generous spirit come April 15, June (whatever) and on through the year?

It seems that some who posted genuine good-will were the type who consistently feel this way. Some only feel like this if given enough "nog"? Some would like to be so good, but quickly lose resolve as daily life takes over once again.

So, has Christmas actually changed anything (other than for the retailers)?
kisholoy mukherjee
Posted: Monday, December 28, 2009 8:31:28 AM
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yassou wrote:
kisholoy mukherjee wrote:


Mrbazoun, I think you misinterpreted yassou. Yassou didn't say every muslim (or non-christian) who don't harbour hatred celebrate christmas. But obviously those who do, cannot or maybe won't celebrate it don't you agree??


^_^ Thank you kisholoy mukherjee. You got the point of my message.


You r most welcome yassou:)
kisholoy mukherjee
Posted: Wednesday, December 30, 2009 9:24:34 AM
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26letters wrote:
" People have shown themselves to be good-hearted, generous, happy, forgiving, etc. - all because that's the kind of person a Christian should be."

I say everyone should be that kind of a person.


As to whether Christmas really affects life or not, I think this sentence of yours, "Some would like to be so good, but quickly lose resolve as daily life takes over once again." explains what happens to most. Only some people are good enough to carry on with the conscious efforts of trying to bring about a positive change in this world. And such people, I don't think need any particular occassion to remind them of their self-appointed duty towards humanity.

J Canada
Posted: Saturday, November 29, 2014 9:56:20 AM

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North america is 80% Christian. Christmas is still the biggest celebration in north america and has been for centuries. I am catholic and of course love christmas. It upsets me when I see alot of minorities not born in Canada in shopping malls tripping over me to buy gifts and celebrate my holiday. I don't feel that is right. I would think they would not like me celebrating their holidays and wearing their outfits and buying their cards and making their food etc. Some faiths would probably turn vicious.

This year I plan to ban all the stores that do not say Merry Christmas. Alot of the stores in Canada are actually American. I realize jews and some other minorities have made themselves rich off christmas and christians with their retail stores, but have the nerve to be rude to our face to say they don't like the words Merry Christmas, but gee our money makes them merry, they don't mind counting it all do they? I find that racict. So if 80% of us give them money we can do alot of damage by not shopping anymore at their stores. I also leave voicemails and send emails to the major stores head offices even in the states. I can compare it to this. You kid has a birthday party at home and kids give him gifts and when a kid passes the gift he says happy easter (instead of happy birthday). This is what we feel like when people don't call our holiday by its real name. What else is ironic is minorities get extra pay to take our holiday off. The other insulting thing is that its white christian men who fought WW2 against the nazis so that minorities could live and have equal rights, then minorities have the nerve to be ungrateful and heartless to us, the very people who saved their asses.
Epiphileon
Posted: Saturday, November 29, 2014 12:06:17 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 3/22/2009
Posts: 4,286
Neurons: 166,516
First let me say, "Happy Solstice" the real winter holiday, with an exact match between the observance and when it happens on the calendar.
Second you must remember that calling ones self a Christian, and actually being a disciple of Christ and making him absolute lord of your life, striving to conform all behavior to his example, are different things.
Under the actual definition of Christian probably 75% of that 80% do not qualify.
According to Christian doctrine, there are no minorities we are all children of God, so I'm guessing I know which percentage you're in.
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