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Should the Canadian Govt Join France in Banning Child Beauty Pageants? Options
Hope1
Posted: Friday, March 9, 2012 11:13:36 PM
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http://lifestyle.sympatico.ca/familyandparenting/dadditude%20contentposting/should_child_beauty_pageants_be_banned/10355acc

What are the benefits of child beauty pageants to the child?

What are the risks?

This is a good discussion.
tootsie
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 1:29:43 AM

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Good Question - absolutely resounding answer - YES to Canadians and NO NO NO to the beauty pageants

and anyone who wants to discuss the benefits

Shame on you Shame on you Shame on you

Geeman
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 3:38:07 AM

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Personally, I don't understand the appeal of child beauty pageants. I'd go so far as to suggest that they should be monitored to assure that the participants aren't being mistreated. There should be some sort of regulation and oversight. There are rules for many activities that children participate in. Sports organizations require safety equipment. The park near my house was recently retro-fitted with safer slides, swings and other playground materials. It's reasonable to require that children who participate in pageants are not being abused physically or mentally by the process.

Banning them, though? That's going too far. One shouldn't mandate taste, and I don't think one need prove benefit to the children involved in order to argue against a ban on something. Since when is proving benefit a requirement for something to avoid being banned outright? Couldn't one make the same argument to promote a ban on youth sports can could easily be as damaging to the health and welfare of children injured and pressured into performance at a tender age? Couldn't a similar argument be made about religious training? Home schooling? Military academies? Child actors?

I suppose the benefit to child beauty contests would be that the children learn about things like singing, dancing, fashion, makeup, etc. Sure, certain folks might have disdain for those things, or think they are not of particular value, but I think an objective look at society would have to admit that those things are valued in such a way that child beauty contests are as valid as afterschool sports, computer camp, cotillion or any number of activities that one group might find pointless, yet another finds important. I've never actually watched that TV show, Glee, but it seems to me that if one were to ban child beauty pageants then glee clubs would have to be pretty near on the agenda. Personally, I don't participate in either activity, but my choice not to be involved is derived from the same right to participate.

Don't think kids should be in beauty contests? Fine. Don't put your kids in them. Don't watch them. Feel free to express your opinion. It's not your business to ban them, though.
Jeech
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 4:30:37 AM
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What about a 7 year old girl in a head-to-toe burka? And the similar aged boy wearing turban on his head while a 'toy beard' on the face?

By going through talibanisations even adults would be prohbited from the beauty pageants.

We adults are actualy the problem being a developed roll model and need to have some moderate lifestyle in first place.

By banning, we only are complicating our laws, this is not a cure.
xsmith
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 9:46:07 AM
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I feel that children's beauty pageants have no redeeming social value . If banned in the US, promoters and sponsors of these programs of child exploitation will be driven underground where they will thrive. If adults had values that promoted constructive activities for children, then children's beauty pageants would not exist. Instead, money hungry adults lacking good judgement and morality choose to exploit children and inculcate them with nonsensical and emotionally destructive values and activities. Skimpy outfits and flirty behavior have no productive place in a child's development. These insidious behaviors and practices promote the sexual objectification of children.

Children's beauty pageants should not be banned because of our first amendment. However, be very very watchful of the sick adults whose goal is to earn a living from child exploitation. These folks need to get a real job and a life.



mailady
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 11:08:37 AM
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It is a baby step above child pornography.
martyg
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 11:13:00 AM
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not a pageant but a world without a shirley temple?

seems a little harsh.
excaelis
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 12:00:37 PM

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While we're at it, can we lose the ' grown-up ' ones too ?

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear...
tootsie
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 12:01:49 PM

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martyg wrote:
not a pageant but a world without a shirley temple?

seems a little harsh.


the world was more innocent when our ST was around. Nowadays, we (unfortunately) know more about child abuse.

Seeker
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 12:07:39 PM
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It seems to me an unhealthy lesson to teach a child that they are valued by their outward appearance. My Grandmother used to say, "Beauty is, as beauty does." True beauty is internal.
Yakcal
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 12:47:14 PM

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As a man I have always felt that children in a 'beauty pageant' was sending a weird message to the child. Children seem to be at risk in these shows as they are sexualized beyond their years. Granted, children of both sexes play dress up using their parents clothing but these shows go far beyond that simple child's play. These little girls are not just dressed up and made up, they are also 'sexed up' in these shows. I've read where the mothers are living vicariously through their daughters and enter the girls into these shows to help with feelings of the loss of their own childhoods. This may be so but how does this make these shows so popular?

If this isn't about the sexing up of these children then where are the shows for the boys? Could it be that make up won't make a little boy look like a grown man but make up and clothing can make a little girl look like a woman?

I don't like these shows but I can't say I'd ban them here or in Canada and to do so will only increase the drive that puts these shows on in the first place. xsmith is right about a ban driving these underground.

Before this ever goes away women, moms type women, will have to face the fact that there are people out there that do not have the best interest of the child in their hearts. I'm sure there is big bucks in these shows. Until moms care more about the child than they do about the pageants and the money they generate I'm afraid these will continue.
Geeman
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 3:42:23 PM

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xsmith wrote:
If banned in the US, promoters and sponsors of these programs of child exploitation will be driven underground where they will thrive.

I have to say the idea of underground child beauty pageants is much more appealing than the current system. Imagine child beauty contestants singing their widdle hearts out in some dripping basement. Gray walls, tinny MP3 music, flickering lights, and little girls in hot pink sailor suits singing "I saw Mommy Kissing Santa Claus" while their rabid mothers cheer and fathers make odds and place bets. Genius.

"The first rule of L'il Miss Muffin Beauty Pageant: No talking about L'il Miss Miffin Beauty Pageant!"

Of course, maybe we should all just drop the pretense and have the little girls slug it out.... In the long run that'd probably be better for them (and more entertaining.)
Romany
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 10:47:10 PM
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I honestly don't see what's so very wrong about banning them - your Constitution notwithstanding. Are they organised by children themselves? Promoted by children? Advertised by children? If not, then the child's rights to conduct them aren't aren't being taken away by a ban.

They're an adult construct and I think, if a Ban were mooted, the question of whether an adult has the right to exploit children for profit would be the point of contention. Child beggars are banned, child prostitution is banned, and child actors now have to be scrutinised and governed by particular regulations regarding education, mental and physical health.

Banning adult beauty pageants I can can understand as being unconstitutional. But banning kids beauty pageants is, to me, an-going legacy of Wilberforce's work in the 19th Century!
excaelis
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 11:27:21 PM

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tootsie wrote:
martyg wrote:
not a pageant but a world without a shirley temple?

seems a little harsh.


the world was more innocent when our ST was around. Nowadays, we (unfortunately) know more about child abuse.



The child abuse was still there. Nowadays, we ( fortunately ) know more about child abuse.
Geeman
Posted: Sunday, March 11, 2012 2:11:00 PM

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Romany wrote:
I honestly don't see what's so very wrong about banning them - your Constitution notwithstanding. Are they organised by children themselves? Promoted by children? Advertised by children? If not, then the child's rights to conduct them aren't aren't being taken away by a ban.

They're an adult construct and I think, if a Ban were mooted, the question of whether an adult has the right to exploit children for profit would be the point of contention. Child beggars are banned, child prostitution is banned, and child actors now have to be scrutinised and governed by particular regulations regarding education, mental and physical health.

Banning adult beauty pageants I can can understand as being unconstitutional. But banning kids beauty pageants is, to me, an-going legacy of Wilberforce's work in the 19th Century!

Children do have a protected status, and often fewer rights than adults. Aside from the obvious things (voting age, drinking, etc.) school newspapers aren't as free as the rest of the press, for example. In "compensation" there are things like child labor laws, relatively free services (that are continually under attack, I'm sorry to say) and a whole different legal system for criminal acts committed by those under 18 (unless the court decides they are an "adult" due to the nature of the crime.)

However, an absolute ban on something is a pretty serious way to go under the Constitution (or in any free society.) The argument is often a "slippery slope" one. If they can ban child beauty pageants, then why not child actors, children's choirs, etc. Then adult beauty contests are next, using the logic based in the ban on child beauty contests.

To me, the real question is when are all these beauty contests going to be opened up fully to men and boys as well as women.... Now there's the REAL discrimination. Since gay marriages aren't recognized in most of the USA (though I understand it's different in Canada) wouldn't that mean that any gay man qualifies as unmarried for the purpose of being crowned "Miss X"? Little boys should be allowed to dress up in sailor suits just like little girls, right? Bring it on. It should be the Li'l Miss/Mister Muffin Beauty Contest!
Sal
Posted: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 1:07:32 PM
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When my son was two, my husband entered him in a local pageant. There was no prize money and the entry fees went to buy playground equipment for a local park. I thought it was silly but went along with the entry for a good cause. I did not even take a camera with me because I did not expect him to win. For talent he did a forward roll, gave me a high five and belw kisses to the crowd. He won and his prize was a party at McDonalds with the other kids who won in their age categories.

For the next year we appeared at every community event that our town had. During that year we helped raise money for an animal shelter,the local library and for food pantires. We dedicated a playgournd, we spent a day at an adult daycare facility, and we helped plant a community garden. This was a good experience for our family. At a very young age my son was exposed to helping others in his community and it became his norm. It was one of his earliest memories and today at 13 he is a very involved kid with the outgoing personality that was just starting to bloom when he was two.

Now, one does not have to win a pageant to become involved in the community, but in our case, it forced us to be much more involved than we would have been otherwise. The pageant question is not so black and white. Pageants can be shallow and not contribute much to a child's development or they can have a very positive impact. It is what you choose to make of them. And yes, I still think my kid is the most beautiful child on the face of the earth.
excaelis
Posted: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 5:39:54 PM

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I'm sure he is, Sal.

After mine !
Jyrkkä Jätkä
Posted: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 5:49:33 PM

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Thanks, Sal,
for giving the reason to have a second thought on this.
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