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sitting US President Options
Koh Elaine
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 3:46:04 AM
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The historic summit is scheduled to take place on 12 June, but many details are still unconfirmed.

It will be the first meeting between a North Korean leader and a sitting US president.

Mr Trump said on Tuesday that plans were "moving along very nicely".

"A lot of relationships being built, a lot of negotiations going on before the trip," he told reporters.

"It's very important - it'll be a very important couple of days."

Why is Trump referred to as a "sitting" US President.
Absinthius
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 4:29:11 AM

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Not only due to his advanced age, but also his unhealthy lifestyle and humongous ego make it hard for Trump to walk long distances or stand up straight for extended periods of time.

That's just my guess though.

Look, how about this? Let's pretend we've had the row and I've won. See? It saves a lot of effort.
papo_308
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 5:20:44 AM
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I would interpret it as "the US president currently in office".
Stephen Senter🇺🇸📰
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 5:47:35 AM

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Make America Great
DraintheSwamp
Stephen Senter🇺🇸📰
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 5:51:24 AM

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Today is South Korea Memorial Day!
Jyrkkä Jätkä
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 6:26:38 AM

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Papo's got it right.


In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.
OnTheVerge
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 7:02:47 AM

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Stephen Senter🇺🇸📰 wrote:
Make America Great
DraintheSwamp


Of Donald tRump and his thoroughly corrupt minions

The world will never starve for want of wonders, but only for want of people who wonder.
thar
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 7:13:36 AM

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As Papo says, incumbent - currently in office.

You stand for election but once you get the job you are sitting! Whistle


They have to specify the first sitting president because there have been meetings before with ex-presidents - Carter and Clinton. But neither was president at the time of the meeting.
Oscar D. Grouch
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 8:02:00 AM

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Absinthius wrote:
Not only due to his advanced age, but also his unhealthy lifestyle and humongous ego make it hard for Trump to walk long distances or stand up straight for extended periods of time.

That's just my guess though.


tRump also cannot walk down slight inclines without holding onto something or somebody.
TMe
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 10:06:43 AM

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Oscar D. Grouch wrote



Absinthius wrote:
Not only due to his advanced age, but also his unhealthy lifestyle and humongous ego make it hard for Trump to walk long distances or stand up straight for extended periods of time.

That's just my guess though.


Applause Applause Applause Applause


I thought it means ..."holding the office currently." I think I am.........?


I am a layman.
Wilmar (USA)
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 2:13:14 PM

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Absinthius wrote:
Not only due to his advanced age, but also his unhealthy lifestyle and humongous ego make it hard for Trump to walk long distances or stand up straight for extended periods of time.

That's just my guess though.


How very, very troll-ish and it makes you look like an idiot. IMHO.
Wilmar (USA)
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 2:14:05 PM

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A sitting president is an expression making reference to the current president, whomever that may be.
Wilmar (USA)
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 2:14:56 PM

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GO Pres. TRUMP! 2020!
Make America Great Again!
Keep America Great!
palapaguy
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 4:33:14 PM

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Wilmar (USA) wrote:
GO Pres. TRUMP! 2020!
Make America Great Again!
Keep America Great!

Applause Dancing Pray
RuthP
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 4:43:13 PM

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Koh Elaine wrote:
The historic summit is scheduled to take place on 12 June, but many details are still unconfirmed.

It will be the first meeting between a North Korean leader and a sitting US president.

Mr Trump said on Tuesday that plans were "moving along very nicely".

"A lot of relationships being built, a lot of negotiations going on before the trip," he told reporters.

"It's very important - it'll be a very important couple of days."

Why is Trump referred to as a "sitting" US President.
There are words in almost every Indoeuropean language, that have a root in sit, that refer to meetings of people governing. They govern everything from modern states to tribes to clans. So "sitting president" is one who is in office, i.e. "sitting" as a part of government.
Eoin Riedy
Posted: Wednesday, June 6, 2018 11:34:20 PM

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RuthP wrote:
There are words in almost every Indoeuropean language, that have a root in sit, that refer to meetings of people governing. They govern everything from modern states to tribes to clans. So "sitting president" is one who is in office, i.e. "sitting" as a part of government.


Moreover, before you can "sit" as an official, you often have to "stand" for the position.
Drag0nspeaker
Posted: Thursday, June 7, 2018 2:27:00 AM

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Thank you to those who answered the vocabulary question.

Please keep politics (especially the US President question) in the Politics section - there's lots of room there thanks.

Besides 'sit' and 'stand', there's also 'chair' . . .


Wyrd bið ful aræd - bull!
Squawk Box
Posted: Thursday, June 7, 2018 1:50:22 PM

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Koh Elaine wrote:
The historic summit is scheduled to take place on 12 June, but many details are still unconfirmed.

It will be the first meeting between a North Korean leader and a sitting US president.

Mr Trump said on Tuesday that plans were "moving along very nicely".

"A lot of relationships being built, a lot of negotiations going on before the trip," he told reporters.

"It's very important - it'll be a very important couple of days."

Why is Trump referred to as a "sitting" US President.

President Trump is the current occupant of the White House, and he sits in the Oval Office. He currently occupies the office of President, so he is the sitting President.

All Presidents retain that title; but there is only one that is current; and then there are the former ones. So using sitting is a way to distinguish between them.

Definition:
2. Occupying an official position; incumbent.
Sitting TFD
Romany
Posted: Thursday, June 7, 2018 7:14:52 PM
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I read the above and realised I wasn't sure what's said in a Parliamentary system? I'd imagine it would be "incumbent"; but is that what it's called by everyone?

I rather think it's our Parliament which sits, while our Prime Ministers "serves"?
Drag0nspeaker
Posted: Friday, June 8, 2018 2:05:45 AM

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Hi Romany.

The Collins shows 'sitting' - but I've never heard it in British politics.

sitting
adj 6. (Government, Politics & Diplomacy) in office: a sitting Member of Parliament.
noun 4. (Parliamentary Procedure) a meeting, esp of an official body, to conduct business


Personally, I think I'd say 'current' and 'past' if I had to distinguish between two.

However, the situation is different here. A different attitude.
Here, Prime Minister is a job which someone holds for a while.
In the States, it seems that it's a title, and is life-long.

Obama IS the forty-oddth President of the USA - he just happens to be 'not in office' right now.
Gordon Brown WAS the Prime Minister in 2008. He is now an ex-Prime Minister, author and something in the UN.

Wyrd bið ful aræd - bull!
Romany
Posted: Friday, June 8, 2018 2:31:35 PM
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And Drago

- I think you have come up with something there: because neither is it merely Presidents who seem to take on the title for life in the USA. (I believe they all have to have security too, no matter how old they are - at the taxpayers expense. Wouldn't wash here, I don't think. Just imagine how many people would have been up for it for Maggie T. for instance?!Think )

But it pertains to service personnel and public servants too in that system, I've recently discovered. The Potus has a lawyer now who once held a mayorial position, I think around 20 years ago. Yet in the last week I've seen that many people, and members of the Press; still address him as "Mayor" Guiliani.

And once, intrigued about constant references to "my" Generals; heard from by so many people in interviews and many media commentators - including his Press-person (Saunders); and how POTUS likes to surround himself with military men "Generals" - I went to find out how this could be? I thought I'd left the realms of leaders being propped up by the military when I left the troubled African continent?

It seems people can't ever retire from active service in America?

Yet I remember when my father finally had to quit the RAF due to ill-health; it would have been 'frightfully bad form' for him to be addressed by any military rank: unthinkable for him to introduce himself by rank now he was a civilian. If we do take the uncommon step of retaining rank in a person's official title for some extraordinary reason,(the person is famous/revered for their truly extraordinary exploits while holding that title/rank) the title must still be used with "ex-" or "former-" preceding it. So we seem to have different traditions pertaining to this nomenclature.

A thing I had never fully taken in before.Think
palapaguy
Posted: Friday, June 8, 2018 6:42:59 PM

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[quote=Romany]

... It seems people can't ever retire from active service in America? ...

It's simple. People retired from high positions in public service in the USA are generally shown respect by addressing them by their former title. Nothing to be confused about - we well understand that the person is no longer in that position. Good manners and all that.
Romany
Posted: Friday, June 8, 2018 9:15:05 PM
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Palapaguy, -

I think you misinterpreted: I was saying how I'd not known of this *previously*; and how it would have *saved* confusion had I known it from the start.

As you will see from my post, this is the complete opposite of how we Brits deal with rank, so while it may be simple to you - because it is, after all your system; so too is the opposite position simple to us, because that's our system. All I was discussing with Drago was yet another instance of the way we interpret and use words that are "understood" by the hearer and the speaker in two completely different ways.
palapaguy
Posted: Friday, June 8, 2018 9:43:40 PM

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Romany wrote:

Palapaguy, -

I think you misinterpreted: I was saying how I'd not known of this *previously*; and how it would have *saved* confusion had I known it from the start.

As you will see from my post, this is the complete opposite of how we Brits deal with rank, so while it may be simple to you - because it is, after all your system; so too is the opposite position simple to us, because that's our system. All I was discussing with Drago was yet another instance of the way we interpret and use words that are "understood" by the hearer and the speaker in two completely different ways.


Understood. I've always loved this: https://quoteinvestigator.com/2016/04/03/common/
mactoria
Posted: Saturday, June 9, 2018 7:33:01 AM
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Holders of most major elected (and often appointed) office in the US are formally referred to be their previous office e.g. former President Bush (Mr. President), former Vice-President Biden (Mr. Vice President), former Senator Kennedy, Honorable Judge So-and-So or just "Judge So-and-So, former Secretary So-and-So (as in presidential cabinet secretaries), former Governor Cuomo, etc. It's not unusual for people to drop the "former" to shorten it up and just refer to the person as "President Bush" or whoever I don't think in most locales that lower level former office holders are commonly referred to by their old title, such as the small town or city mayor (though former mayors of large cities like LA or New York might be referred to by "former Mayor So-and-So"). In the US it's also common in formal settings (such as being interviewed on a TV show, being introduced to give a speech, etc.) to refer to high-ranking military officers by their old job titles, eg General, Colonel, Admiral, etc. Then again, in informal settings or chats about our former and current elected/appointed officials, we would just refer to people by Mr. or Mrs. or even their last name (e.g. while some might say "Obama" to show lack of respect, many others say "Obama" because he's ubiquitous or to show fondness). Calling someone by their former title is just a standard used in certain situations such as TV, journalism, public forums, conventions, etc.

In what is supposed to be a democracy of equals where public service in the government doesn't put one above everyone else it may seem contrary and an oddity to some. But it's just a way to show appreciation for someone's prior public service.

I understand from Romany that this is done differently in the UK. In the US we would tend to refer to Tony Blair, for example, as "former Prime Minister Blair" or in an ongoing conversation as just "Prime Minister Blair" or "Mr. Prime Minister" instead of Mr. Blair or Tony, etc.
Drag0nspeaker
Posted: Sunday, June 10, 2018 2:08:56 AM

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Hi mactoria.
You said why we (all of 'we') in the UK (and maybe elsewhere in the old Commonwealth) find it a bit odd to call an ex-something by the old job-title.

Quote:
In what is supposed to be a democracy of equals where public service in the government doesn't put one above everyone else it may seem contrary and an oddity to some.


Would you call the ex-stores-manager in your factory "Mr Stores-manager" or even "the Stores-manager" ten years after he/she had retired?

Any job in government is a job. It's something you are paid to do (and which you are expected to be skilled in).
Some MPs have two or more jobs - and they are paid for each one - and they are expected to do each one properly.

The Prime Minister is a Member of Parliament (along with lots of other members) elected (like all other MPs) by the populace within one constituency in one town. The job of an MP is to represent the people of that constituency, and try to guide the government as a whole to act in a way which benefits those people.
He/she is also leader of the party (Conservative, Labour, Liberals whatever) elected by the annual/periodic Party Conference attendees. This job is completely different - it is to lead the party - a political job, but not a government job. The 'wages' are paid from party membership fees, not national taxes.
As Prime Minister, the job is to act as liaison between Parliament and the Monarch and to lead the country as a whole.

Within Parliament - during a sitting, in a discussion - An MP would call the Prime Minister "Ms. Prime Minister" when speaking to her as the Prime Minister - asking her about something which is the function of that job.
Someone interviewing the PM on TV about what the government is doing is interviewing The Prime Minister, not Theresa May.
Someone interviewing her about the Conservative Party, its rationale, goals etc. is interviewing the Leader of the Party - not the Prime Minister.
Someone interviewing her about her history as a politician, her education, the charities she supports etc. is interviewing Theresa May - not The Prime Minister.

Someone interviewing Tony Blair about anything is interviewing Tony Blair - not The Prime Minister. They might mention that he is the Ex-Prime Minister, just to identify him, or to remind the viewers why anyone is bothering to interview him.


Wyrd bið ful aræd - bull!
thar
Posted: Sunday, June 10, 2018 8:09:53 AM

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I think America is extremely unusual in having only one 'head of state'? Most places that do not have a monarch, emperor, grand duke, emir or something, have a ceremonial president and a political prime minister.

When Iceland became independent from Denmark, the role of the King/Queen of Denmark was pretty much transferred intact to the elected President of Iceland - a non-political position historically chosen by respect, and they have been people who have been very popular and tended to serve (re-elected if they choose to stand) for 15-20 years, until they choose to retire.
It means you can support the president while campaigning against the government and the prime minister. Makes things less murky all round!

If the US didn't combine the two, you wouldn't get the problem like you see with the football team being disinvited from the White House - the conflation of support for a particular politician with patriotism.
Maybe they thought their inbuilt checks would control the president and stop him becoming a 'king' - but they did not realise that a constitutional monarchy needs a strong PM to tell the king 'no!' The majority leader of Senate or Congress (I don't know what you call them, and I don't know who they are, which is revealing in itself, although I assume anybody with more political interest would know) do not seem to have taken that role - so you are left with just the one figure to symbolise all power.

Maybe the US devised its system before the pitfalls of this became apparent- and the thinkers of the day were too blinded to see that maybe some people would really not like the president! But the French after creating their revolutionary republic, after a disastrous detour into Emperors, have ended up with president and a PM - although they have their own way of defining those roles. Whistle

The only places I can think of where that system existed or exists is communist countries - where disagreeing with the political 'leader' of the single party was by definition unpatriotic and treasonous.
Of course you then still fake the change in places like Russia by pretending to have both a president and a PM with their own power. But you don't really fool anybody.

Ashwin Joshi
Posted: Sunday, June 10, 2018 10:06:29 AM

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"Four sitting judges of the Supreme Court of India addressing a press conference was no doubt an unusual step, but that does not make it illegal or improper as some have suggested. The self-imposed code of conduct for judges has been cited in support of saying that judges are not supposed to go to the press."

Sitting judges of the Supreme Court of India means "still serving in the Supreme of India".

Me Gathering Pebbles at The Seashore.-Aj
thar
Posted: Sunday, June 10, 2018 10:29:41 AM

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Well, they have to be sitting because they are on the bench.

As opposed to the lawyers who are at the bar.

It gets confusing when you sitting on a standing committee, though.
If you are the chair of a standing committee, does that mean you have nothing to do?

Whistle
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