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Profile: Nikitus
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User Name: Nikitus
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Joined: Tuesday, September 17, 2013
Last Visit: Monday, March 11, 2019 6:55:52 PM
Number of Posts: 399
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  Last 10 Posts
Topic: Rising from his seat with a smile on his face
Posted: Monday, March 11, 2019 4:19:10 PM
FounDit wrote:
Also, writing is an art. Not everyone can write well. Even people who try to write in their native language may not be very good at it. The word choices, the style of writing (which is the "voice" the author uses"); all these influence how an author writes. The combination of an excellent vocabulary, a skill in creating sentences, in crating a plot, and the choices of how to combine all those form the art of writing. That said, I think if you want to write in English, you have to "think" in English. This would be true in any language.



Yes, you are right.
Topic: Rising from his seat with a smile on his face
Posted: Monday, March 11, 2019 4:16:06 PM
Drag0nspeaker wrote:
Hi again.
A question - which may help with future answers - Is this your own writing in Spanish, which you then translate into English? or is it a paragraph from a Spanish story or novel which you are translating to English?

Your grammar is pretty good (probably as good as many English people's grammar) - you don't use adjectives as adverbs, you usually use the correct tense (or you ask) and so on.
Most of the 'corrections' or 'suggestions' we seem to give are about 'sentence structure' - and that may be because the original Spanish sentences just don't work when translated literally.
I don't know Spanish (except a few odd words), but looking at Latin or French (which are similar in some ways) . . .
If I simply translated a sentence from English and then back into English, it could sound very odd.

The grass on the hill is not green.
The grass not is not green on the hill. or even
Grass not is not on the hill green.

You may have to read the Spanish sentence, make sure that you understand it, then write what you understand in English. It's not quite so simple, but may produce the end result more easily.

*******
I understand about sentence-length. If you use ONLY simple, one-verb, one-clause sentences, a story would sound very strange - staccato.
If you tell the whole story in one complex/compound sentence, it can be unreadable.
However, achieving a balance is very much "writing style".
We, as readers (not as writers), can say "that sounds a bit odd" or "that sentence seems too complex" - but that can only help so far. To go the rest of the way, you probably need a writer, or - even better - someone who has successfully taught writers.



The sentences are created by me and then translated. One mistake may be to shorten them so that everything I want to ask fits in one post.

You're right, I'm going to rethink my next questions to not make the same mistakes.


Topic: Rising from his seat with a smile on his face
Posted: Saturday, March 9, 2019 1:36:53 AM
Nikitus wrote:
Nikitus wrote:
thar wrote:
I will just add a thought. I don't want it to look like we are ganging up on you, so I will keep it short. And I don't forget that you are writing and I am not, so that puts anything you write at better than anything I write! So please don't feel criticised, except in a good way!

I appreciate your comments. I think that with it one advances and learns. Personally I think that if you wanted to write about a topic that interests you, you would do very well.


Although everyone has their own style of writing, yours is definitely hard to read. It feels unfocused, with a single sentence containing ideas about what they did, and what they thought, and what had happened to them, and who they were.
I think you are focusing so much on the language technique - relative clauses, participle clauses etc, that you have forgotten that the reader needs each sentence to have one idea or group of related ideas. An action or a thought - something that moves the story on and makes you want to know what happens next.

I think there may be a problem in thinking in Spanish, trying to translate into English and also shortening the sentences so that sentences are not too long to not abuse of the goodwill of this forum. On the other hand if the sentences are too short, I would have to put all the previous context. But maybe this is a good solution.


Ask yourself 'what is the main point of this sentence?' They moved? They did something? They thought something? what had happened before? Then you can add more detail, colour. What they were thinking as they moved? Where they were moving as they thought? But only one or two extra ideas, or the whole sentence becomes so muddled with subsidiary phrases and clauses you don't know what the main point is.

You are right


If your story were a journey, you have so many diversions the poor traveller gets lost! You can point out the interesting scenery along the way, but your passenger still needs to feel that you are going somewhere.



Once again, you are right. I want to avoid the fact that I want to cover many things and not focus on something specific.
Topic: Rising from his seat with a smile on his face
Posted: Saturday, March 9, 2019 1:35:26 AM
Nikitus wrote:
thar wrote:
I will just add a thought. I don't want it to look like we are ganging up on you, so I will keep it short. And I don't forget that you are writing and I am not, so that puts anything you write at better than anything I write! So please don't feel criticised, except in a good way!

I appreciate your comments. I think that with it one advances and learns. Personally I think that if you wanted to write about a topic that interests you, you would do very well.


Although everyone has their own style of writing, yours is definitely hard to read. It feels unfocused, with a single sentence containing ideas about what they did, and what they thought, and what had happened to them, and who they were.
I think you are focusing so much on the language technique - relative clauses, participle clauses etc, that you have forgotten that the reader needs each sentence to have one idea or group of related ideas. An action or a thought - something that moves the story on and makes you want to know what happens next.

I think there may be a problem in thinking in Spanish, trying to translate into English and also shortening the sentences so that sentences are not too long to not abuse of the goodwill of this forum. On the other hand if the sentences are too short, I would have to put all the previous context. But maybe this is a good solution.


Ask yourself 'what is the main point of this sentence?' They moved? They did something? They thought something? what had happened before? Then you can add more detail, colour. What they were thinking as they moved? Where they were moving as they thought? But only one or two extra ideas, or the whole sentence becomes so muddled with subsidiary phrases and clauses you don't know what the main point is.

You are right


If your story were a journey, you have so many diversions the poor traveller gets lost! You can point out the interesting scenery along the way, but your passenger still needs to feel that you are going somewhere.
Topic: Rising from his seat with a smile on his face
Posted: Saturday, March 9, 2019 1:34:06 AM
thar wrote:
I will just add a thought. I don't want it to look like we are ganging up on you, so I will keep it short. And I don't forget that you are writing and I am not, so that puts anything you write at better than anything I write! So please don't feel criticised, except in a good way!

I appreciate your comments. I think that with it one advances and learns. Personally I think that if you wanted to write about a topic that interests you, you would do very well.


Although everyone has their own style of writing, yours is definitely hard to read. It feels unfocused, with a single sentence containing ideas about what they did, and what they thought, and what had happened to them, and who they were.
I think you are focusing so much on the language technique - relative clauses, participle clauses etc, that you have forgotten that the reader needs each sentence to have one idea or group of related ideas. An action or a thought - something that moves the story on and makes you want to know what happens next.

I think there may be a problem in thinking in Spanish, trying to translate into English and also shortening the sentences so that sentences are not too long to not abuse of the goodwill of this forum. On the other hand if the sentences are too short, I would have to put all the previous context. But maybe this is a good solution.


Ask yourself 'what is the main point of this sentence?' They moved? They did something? They thought something? what had happened before? Then you can add more detail, colour. What they were thinking as they moved? Where they were moving as they thought? But only one or two extra ideas, or the whole sentence becomes so muddled with subsidiary phrases and clauses you don't know what the main point is.

If your story were a journey, you have so many diversions the poor traveller gets lost! You can point out the interesting scenery along the way, but your passenger still needs to feel that you are going somewhere.
Topic: Rising from his seat with a smile on his face
Posted: Saturday, March 9, 2019 1:29:00 AM
Drag0nspeaker wrote:
Hi Nick.
I'm going to add more, but it is NOT more errors.
I'm going to explain in my words why I'm not too keen on your original post.

Firstly (as pjharvey says) there's something wrong with time.
The feeling of being excluded was years ago. That "HAD a feeling" is the only finite verb in that sentence - so the whole sentence is set "years ago".
The participle phrase "rising from his seat" says what was happening at the same time as he had that feeling, years ago.

I agree with Parpar's suggestions, though I would probably connect one pair of sentences, and omit one word.

The thin young man had long suffered from shyness, which made him taciturn. For many years, he had experienced the feeling of being excluded from the rest of his companions.
Rising from his seat with a smile, he took his place at the front of the room. Being the first student chosen by his teacher was an honour, and it was flattering to be recognised this way. He knew that she appreciated the months of effort he had put into his studies and practice.



Thanks for all your help and time. I will study your answer.
Topic: Rising from his seat with a smile on his face
Posted: Saturday, March 9, 2019 1:27:11 AM
Parpar1836 wrote:
The thin young man had long suffered from shyness, which made him taciturn. For many years, he had experienced the feeling of being excluded from the rest of his companions. Rising from his seat with a smile, he took his place at the front of the room. Being the first student chosen by his teacher was an honor. It was flattering to be recognized this way. And he knew that she appreciated the months of effort he had put into his studies and practice.



Once again, thanks for your inspiring sentences!
Topic: Rising from his seat with a smile on his face
Posted: Saturday, March 9, 2019 1:26:15 AM
pjharvey wrote:
I think that you didn't divide the sentences in the correct way. If I guess right, "rising from his seat with a smile on his face" is something that happens when he is called out by the teacher. However, you separated the two events with a full-stop. You should link them, on the contrary, and add the "years ago" thing as an aside.
Moreover, "with few words" isn't connected with anything; when you stand up you don't necessarily utter words; so you should express it better, adding a linking verb, such as "rising from his seat and saying a few words of acknowledgement", or something similar.


Yes, you are right. I have to fix that problem with my sentences.

Furthermore, some vocabulary and grammar things: "that" in "that feeling" doesn't sound right, because there is no other reference to the feeling in your text, so "the" would be better; and he did feel flattered, probably, but it wasn't the teacher's intention to flatter him , so he felt flattered, but not by the teacher (wipe out "by the teacher"); "had recognized" is a wrong tense choice, because what matters is that the teacher recognized his efforts at the moment when the action takes place, and not that he had recognized them before, so use the past simple; "the effort" is better plural ("the efforts"), because we are not talking about a single effort, but about a series of them.

Victor is right that your sentences are far too long.


Yes, I have to check my grammar. But I am more worried about the tenses.
Topic: Rising from his seat with a smile on his face
Posted: Saturday, March 9, 2019 1:24:33 AM
Víctor Lplz wrote:
Dear Nikitus,
A tip about your writing style. In general terms, the difference between a good and a bad writer is how long his/her sentences are. The shorter they are, the better will be that writer.


Thanks for your help!
Topic: Rising from his seat with a smile on his face
Posted: Wednesday, March 6, 2019 10:30:13 PM
Hello.

First of all, thanks for all your time and help.

Are the following sentences grammatically correct?

"Rising from his seat with a smile on his face, the thin young man, with few words due to his shyness, had years ago that feeling of being excluded from the rest of his companions. Being the first chosen made him feel flattered by the teacher, who had recognized the effort of that young man in his classes."

Thanks.

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