|
leonAzul |
|
Advanced Member |
|
United States, FL |
| musician, computer consultant |
| reading, bicycling, taijiquan |
| None Specified |
|
|
Thursday, August 11, 2011 |
|
Wednesday, February 22, 2012 6:27:51 PM |
1,331
[0.50% of all post / 6.76 posts per day] |
|
Epiphileon wrote:
If this is too much to cover in a week, we can just extend it a week.
At this point in the book, I don't think slowing down will help. If anything, breaking the material into smaller chunks is making Jaynes more fragmentary, for me, and that is why I am struggling with loose ends, trying to tie it together with the main points.
Chapter by chapter seems about right, for me. This part of the book is mostly presentation of observations and interpretations. These are not finely argued points that require a great deal of discussion, but rather evidence that needs to be qualified as acceptable or not.
Sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes? - Juvenal
|
If today were Wednesday, then either example would be acceptable and clear in everyday conversation. Yet as thar and FounDit point out, it isn't entirely logical.
One way to write this so that the sense of additional information is conveyed would be to use a "—" (dash) instead of a "," (comma) as a separator.
"I haven't seen him for two days — since Monday."
A more natural way would be to break it up into two clauses (with some extra words to help the flow):
"I haven't seen him since Monday; that's two whole days, now."
Sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes? - Juvenal
|
rogermue wrote:Where are you coming from?
How would an American pronounce that?
1 Where are YOU coming from?
2 Where are you COMing from?
3 WHERE are you coming from?
Each of these can be heard, and each has its own nuance.
The first would be most confrontational. It emphasizes the peculiarity of someone's behavior or thinking, and not in a nice way.
The second would be the most neutral. It mostly expresses surprise or incredulity, but with greater emphasis could also express irritation or impatience.
The third emphasizes the utter daftness of the behavior or opinion, and the word "WHERE" would also be drawn out in time with a slight pause after it as well.
I should caution that this is a very subjective interpretation, yet I suspect many native speakers of English from Canada or the USA would agree with me.
Sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes? - Juvenal
|
Drag0nspeaker wrote:Thanks leon - so it really does exist and isn't a figment of our stockroom clerk's imagination! I think this is probably where Feanor's colleague got his idea from. 
Indeed! Sorry, I was adding something while you responded. I didn't mean to be tricky or anything. 
Sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes? - Juvenal
|
Drag0nspeaker wrote:Though it is not in any dictionary I can find so far, it is common to find it in stock lists (in engineering stock rooms, office stationers etc) in this construction:
Spanners, 1 inch, 5 off
Wrenches, adjustable, 3 off
Screwdrivers, flat-head, large, 7 off
or
paperclips, boxes of 100, 20 off
staples, pack of 1000, 60 off
paper, A4, reams, 30 off
That's an accounting convention where items are struck off the inventory as they are used or sold.
Edited to add: I have also heard contractors using such language to set up a "take off" sheet, or bill of materials, for a particular project. Retailers use a similar inventory system to control "shortage," "breakage," "shrinkage," etc. — all euphemisms for pilfering.
Sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes? - Juvenal
|
Romany wrote:The usage Leon is talking about seems to have spread out of the USA over the past years but even using it this way - "She SO isn't going to go" (She is absolutely determined not to go, OR she's deliberately made other plans)wouldn't quite fit in here, would it? The "that" wouldn't work.
When used this way the 'SO' is always emphasised: it's a slang use, and I couldn't see people using "that" which would be really formal.One would tend rather to say "He SO sings just so other people can admire him."...but then the word 'admire' becomes problematic: - simply can't imagine people who use this phrase using the word "admire." The whole sentence would be expressed differently viz: - "He SO sings just to show off."
I simply tend to think that the usage as the OP heard/saw it was just incorrect.
I agree.
As Jyrkkä Jätkä and Drag0nspeaker note it has a certain archaic or dramatic sound to it, and I for one can definitely recall my school mates and me using archaic or historical phrases for satirical effect.
For example there was an incident involving a skipped school day, a bottle of vodka, and some Girl Friends which we later referred to as "A Day of Infamy." There is no doubt in my mind that had it occurred today we would have called the unoccupied house "Ground Zero!" 
Sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes? - Juvenal
|
There is an expression "one-off" that means a one-time exchange rather than a continual business relationship, but something tells me it is more like what thar said: it has to to with a local accent, or maybe even a hearing problem.
I hope you don't mind if I sniggered at the thought of someone having "draws trouble."
(Blame it on the mardi gras ;) )
Sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes? - Juvenal
|
ahmetwrt wrote:
"He so sings that everyone admires him."
It was the first time I'd seen such a formation. Of course, it does make sense and therefore well-understood, but I want to learn how "grammmatical" and "wide-spread" it is.
It is not widespread at all. I have only heard constructions like this in slang, and the meaning is very different from what you might think. It would be used with emphasis on the word "so", as in "He so sings that everyone admires him," with the sense that the only reason he sings is to receive compliments.
This is from an AE perspective; I'm quite sure others will hear this differently.
Sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes? - Juvenal
|
Drag0nspeaker wrote:
"where are you coming from?" = What you say makes no sense - what do you mean? Where did you get that idea? (I think it is much more an American expression, so maybe an American could explain it better)
EDIT - I was right, someone else got there before me!
You are also right that if it is asked in an excited tone of voice it can come off as very confrontational, so it should be used with care.
If I recall correctly, it had its peak popularity in AE during the 1970s, so it could sound a little dated in any but a very informal context, kind of how it would sound if I were to describe that "phraseology as real jive, man".
Sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes? - Juvenal
|
explaintome wrote:Hi Is there any difference between the two questions if any?
where do you come from?
where are you coming from?
There is a difference in connotation between the two.
At least in AE, the question "Where do you come from?" almost always refers to one's place of birth, or the area where one feels at home.
The question "Where are you coming from?" can have different meanings depending on context. If a border patrol officer were to ask it, one had better be prepared to offer a clear account of one's most recent point of departure and current destination. In more informal circumstances, it could mean "What is your point of view?"
Sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes? - Juvenal
|
|