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The Incoherence of the Philosophers Options
Daemon
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2014 12:00:00 AM
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The Incoherence of the Philosophers

The Incoherence of the Philosophers is a landmark 11th-century text by al-Ghazali of the rational-based Asharite school of Muslim theology. In it, he criticizes the Avicennian school of Islamic philosophy, accusing its followers of being irreligious. Among al-Ghazali's 20 charges against them is their inability to prove the existence of God and inability to prove the impossibility of the existence of two gods. Who refuted al-Ghazali's views with The Incoherence of the Incoherence? More...
CheVegas ☁️ ✈ ☁️
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2014 1:39:01 AM

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No matter how pretty we try to paint it, all religions are extraordinary supernatural claims requiring extraordinary evidence...yet they cannot even produce ordinary evidence.

Never let a Muslim tell you that Islam is a "religion of peace." Anyone making this statement does not understand the Qur'an, or is lying to you. Its surahs contain unspeakable ideas, commands, and mandates.

It is just as violent as Christianity was during the Inquisition and Crusades, and just as false.
youme
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2014 7:00:08 PM
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Well Chevegas... You're right, Islam is not a religion of peace, and yet peace in arabic is "salam" the same word used for greeting and the same "shalum" used in hebrew, while the word islam means submission and surrender (to the creator), and if that can help you, the prophet had a jewish neighbour who kept throwing garbage near the door of the prophet, and the day he didn't find any garbage near his door he went to visit him as he was sick, this same jew reverted to islam after what happened, the people of the book (christians and jews) are welcome in any muslim country providing that they pay the "jizya", nowadays there are many non-muslims who live peacefully in muslim countries, and there are many muslims who are killed everyday "peacefully", is that enough to call islam a religion of peace? When you said that islam is as violent and as false as christianity was it your point of view or a fact that you proved? And another thing to add is that no one is allowed to paint religion, it is just something to take or leave and no one obliges anyone to adopt any religion.
Guto André
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2014 8:29:54 PM

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Who refuted al-Ghazali's views with The Incoherence of the Incoherence?

Ibn Rushd (Averroes) wrote a refutation of Al-Ghazali's work entitled The Incoherence of the Incoherence (Tahāfut al-Tahāfut) in which he defends the doctrines of the philosophers and criticizes al-Ghazali's own arguments.
excaelis
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2014 9:44:09 PM

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And none of them, if they acknowledge the divine, know jack shit.

Sanity is not statistical
capitán
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2014 10:36:11 PM

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excaelis wrote:
And none of them, if they acknowledge the divine, know jack shit.

---
Amen, sir... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RT6rL2UroE
mangezi
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2014 11:11:46 PM

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Chevegas wrote:
No matter how pretty we try to paint it, all religions are extraordinary supernatural claims requiring extraordinary evidence...yet they cannot even produce ordinary evidence.

Never let a Muslim tell you that Islam is a "religion of peace." Anyone making this statement does not understand the Qur'an, or is lying to you. Its surahs contain unspeakable ideas, commands, and mandates.

It is just as violent as Christianity was during the Inquisition and Crusades, and just as false.
Chevegas, the word "jihaad" makes all the difference; to say in the muslim world wars can be holy or evil depending on who you are fighting and who sent you. Shiites and Sunnis are moslems but they cannot bend down and shut eyes together in one temple. One will never open those eyes.

I am not a genius. I am just a tremendous bundle of experience - Richard Fuller.
mangezi
Posted: Thursday, January 23, 2014 11:19:11 PM

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youme wrote:
Well Chevegas... You're right, Islam is not a religion of peace, and yet peace in arabic is "salam" the same word used for greeting and the same "shalum" used in hebrew, while the word islam means submission and surrender (to the creator), and if that can help you, the prophet had a jewish neighbour who kept throwing garbage near the door of the prophet, and the day he didn't find any garbage near his door he went to visit him as he was sick, this same jew reverted to islam after what happened, the people of the book (christians and jews) are welcome in any muslim country providing that they pay the "jizya", nowadays there are many non-muslims who live peacefully in muslim countries, and there are many muslims who are killed everyday "peacefully", is that enough to call islam a religion of peace? When you said that islam is as violent and as false as christianity was it your point of view or a fact that you proved? And another thing to add is that no one is allowed to paint religion, it is just something to take or leave and no one obliges anyone to adopt any religion.
Brick wall youme, welcome. We are all ears. Killings in Kenya, Usa etc make me deaf to Islam defence.

I am not a genius. I am just a tremendous bundle of experience - Richard Fuller.
youme
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:11:21 AM
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Mr Muketah: you mean you're all eyes? :p
Killing is not something new to humanity, the first killing in human history was a man killed by his own brother, and people used to kill each others just for food or even the color of their skins and other reasons but religion, there were also many extermination crimes commited in the name of religion, if you take animals as an example, an animal fights another one when they share the same food or when this animal threatens its kingdom or when they want to get their chances to breed, some animals are considered to be a food for others, humans are not so different, they even add some stupid reasons like slavery and power, religion is the thing that is supposed to differenciate humans from animals and prevent them from killing, I can show you show you some religious texts which state clearly that killing is forbidden, so I confirm: islam never commited any crime, and none of the three religions is supposed to kill, people who belong to a certain religion ain't angels, all humans are equal so no surprises if they kill, "killings in kinya" and the "killings BY the US"... Let's send them some flowers and ask them gently to stop all of that, well what happens actually is that they send soldiers and guns instead, anyway the topic is about philosophy, and I don't know why it turned into a discussion about "killing", so I'll just stop here and wish you the best :)
CheVegas ☁️ ✈ ☁️
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:51:10 AM

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youme wrote:
... is that enough to call islam a religion of peace?


I've lived in 6 different Muslim nations/kingdoms. You, however, are living inside a bubble of wishful thinking. You need to read more books, and please make them different books...not "holy" books.

Regarding proof, the onus of proof belongs to the person making the claim. If I proclaim that Elvis is in the building, it isn't your duty to prove that he isn't. It's my duty to prove that he is.

Lastly, humans can't "take or leave" religion, as you say. I wish it were that simple.

Religion imposes itself on everyone: war; apartheid; laws; etc. Before 1973, for example, an American woman could not have an abortion if she was violently raped and impregnated by her father, even if the pregnancy would kill her. In Alabama, it is illegal (sodomy) to perform cunnilingus on your girlfriend in the privacy of your own home. In Dubai, an unmarried couple will go to jail if they have sexual intercourse. A married couple will go to jail if they kiss in public.

I could go on forever.

All of this is due to uptight uneducated childlike religion "leaders." Religion is the most destructive, divisive, intellectually retarding creation ever invented by humankind.

Those who believe it are embarrassingly uninformed.
youme
Posted: Saturday, January 25, 2014 2:55:40 PM
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Those are your points of view, keep expressing yourself and write them in bold caracters, it won't change a thing, I'm supposed to be nice and say "I respect your points of view", goodnight :)
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