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Some systems force the COMMIT log record to the disk Options
Tara2
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 7:11:58 AM

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Joined: 11/8/2017
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Can you please explain the bolded part? I can't understand that.

"Some systems force the COMMIT log record to the disk as soon as the COMMIT request is received, others wait until (e.g.) the buffer is full before forcing it to the disk."
An Introduction to Database Systems, 8th edition, C J Date
thar
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 8:00:31 AM

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Note - not my field, so these are just working through the logical use of language.

The action is to force something to the disk.
Here, the thing being forced to the disc is the COMMIT log record - the log record of the COMMIT commands
What that means in technical terms I don't know.

Some systems do it instantly
some systems wait for something to trigger this action (for example it only happens when the buffer is full)


subject verb
object
prepositional phrase

"Some systems force
the COMMIT log record
to the disk
as soon as the COMMIT request is received,

others wait until the buffer is full
before
forcing it to the disk."





Tara2
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 9:51:47 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 11/8/2017
Posts: 1,510
Neurons: 6,111
thar wrote:
Note - not my field, so these are just working through the logical use of language.

The action is to force something to the disk.
Here, the thing being forced to the disc is the COMMIT log record - the log record of the COMMIT commands
What that means in technical terms I don't know.

Some systems do it instantly
some systems wait for something to trigger this action (for example it only happens when the buffer is full)


subject verb
object
prepositional phrase

"Some systems force
the COMMIT log record
to the disk
as soon as the COMMIT request is received,

others wait until the buffer is full
before
forcing it to the disk."






Many thanks thar, for the excellent explanation. Angel Angel
Sorry thar, can you please explain "to the disc"? Is that like "inside the disc", please?
FounDit
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 11:07:32 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 9/19/2011
Posts: 12,815
Neurons: 62,670
Tara2 wrote:
thar wrote:
Note - not my field, so these are just working through the logical use of language.

The action is to force something to the disk.
Here, the thing being forced to the disc is the COMMIT log record - the log record of the COMMIT commands
What that means in technical terms I don't know.

Some systems do it instantly
some systems wait for something to trigger this action (for example it only happens when the buffer is full)


subject verb
object
prepositional phrase

"Some systems force
the COMMIT log record
to the disk
as soon as the COMMIT request is received,

others wait until the buffer is full
before
forcing it to the disk."






Many thanks thar, for the excellent explanation. Angel Angel
Sorry thar, can you please explain "to the disc"? Is that like "inside the disc", please?

I would take it to mean "written" to the disc. Unless computing has changed drastically since my days in it, the buffer area is just temporary storage for data until it is permanently written to the disk. And the only "force" used is a simple "write" command, given either at the COMMIT prompt, or when the buffer area becomes filled.
Tara2
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 12:03:34 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 11/8/2017
Posts: 1,510
Neurons: 6,111
FounDit wrote:
Tara2 wrote:
thar wrote:
Note - not my field, so these are just working through the logical use of language.

The action is to force something to the disk.
Here, the thing being forced to the disc is the COMMIT log record - the log record of the COMMIT commands
What that means in technical terms I don't know.

Some systems do it instantly
some systems wait for something to trigger this action (for example it only happens when the buffer is full)


subject verb
object
prepositional phrase

"Some systems force
the COMMIT log record
to the disk
as soon as the COMMIT request is received,

others wait until the buffer is full
before
forcing it to the disk."






Many thanks thar, for the excellent explanation. Angel Angel
Sorry thar, can you please explain "to the disc"? Is that like "inside the disc", please?

I would take it to mean "written" to the disc. Unless computing has changed drastically since my days in it, the buffer area is just temporary storage for data until it is permanently written to the disk. And the only "force" used is a simple "write" command, given either at the COMMIT prompt, or when the buffer area becomes filled.

Many, many thanks FounDit!!!
Sorry FounDit can I ask the meaning of 'record' here too? Is it mean one record of a table?
FounDit
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 2:17:53 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 9/19/2011
Posts: 12,815
Neurons: 62,670
Tara2 wrote:
FounDit wrote:
Tara2 wrote:
thar wrote:
Note - not my field, so these are just working through the logical use of language.

The action is to force something to the disk.
Here, the thing being forced to the disc is the COMMIT log record - the log record of the COMMIT commands
What that means in technical terms I don't know.

Some systems do it instantly
some systems wait for something to trigger this action (for example it only happens when the buffer is full)


subject verb
object
prepositional phrase

"Some systems force
the COMMIT log record
to the disk
as soon as the COMMIT request is received,

others wait until the buffer is full
before
forcing it to the disk."






Many thanks thar, for the excellent explanation. Angel Angel
Sorry thar, can you please explain "to the disc"? Is that like "inside the disc", please?

I would take it to mean "written" to the disc. Unless computing has changed drastically since my days in it, the buffer area is just temporary storage for data until it is permanently written to the disk. And the only "force" used is a simple "write" command, given either at the COMMIT prompt, or when the buffer area becomes filled.

Many, many thanks FounDit!!!
Sorry FounDit can I ask the meaning of 'record' here too? Is it mean one record of a table?

Yes. This definition fits:

n. rec·ord (rĕk′ərd)
5. Computers A collection of related, often adjacent items of data, treated as a unit.
Tara2
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 3:04:17 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 11/8/2017
Posts: 1,510
Neurons: 6,111
Thanks a lot, FounDit for all your help!!!
Sorry FounDit, do you know Forums to ask Database questions or operating system questions there? I just know Stack Overflow forum, but there's difficult to ask. Do you know another forums that answer computer-Engineering-lessons questions?
taurine
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 4:43:03 PM

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Joined: 4/20/2016
Posts: 2,104
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Location: South Dublin, Ireland
FounDit
Posted: Friday, January 24, 2020 10:24:33 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 9/19/2011
Posts: 12,815
Neurons: 62,670
Tara2 wrote:
Thanks a lot, FounDit for all your help!!!
Sorry FounDit, do you know Forums to ask Database questions or operating system questions there? I just know Stack Overflow forum, but there's difficult to ask. Do you know another forums that answer computer-Engineering-lessons questions?


No, I'm sorry, I don't. However, I believe from some of his answers that leonAzul is into programming and computers. Perhaps if you PM him, he could direct you if I'm right.
Tara2
Posted: Saturday, January 25, 2020 1:56:55 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 11/8/2017
Posts: 1,510
Neurons: 6,111
FounDit wrote:
Tara2 wrote:
Thanks a lot, FounDit for all your help!!!
Sorry FounDit, do you know Forums to ask Database questions or operating system questions there? I just know Stack Overflow forum, but there's difficult to ask. Do you know another forums that answer computer-Engineering-lessons questions?


No, I'm sorry, I don't. However, I believe from some of his answers that leonAzul is into programming and computers. Perhaps if you PM him, he could direct you if I'm right.

Many thanks!!!
Reiko07
Posted: Saturday, January 25, 2020 3:28:41 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 10/30/2018
Posts: 933
Neurons: 4,662
FounDit wrote:

I would take it to mean "written" to the disc

Is the following sentence correct?

Some systems are designed to issue a command to write the commit log record on the HDD/SSD as soon as the commit request is received.

FounDit
Posted: Sunday, January 26, 2020 10:17:37 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 9/19/2011
Posts: 12,815
Neurons: 62,670
Reiko07 wrote:
FounDit wrote:

I would take it to mean "written" to the disc

Is the following sentence correct?

Some systems are designed to issue a command to write the commit log record on the HDD/SSD as soon as the commit request is received.


It looks good to me.
thar
Posted: Sunday, January 26, 2020 10:30:08 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 7/8/2010
Posts: 21,410
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Yes, it is not as if the disk can refuse!

But presumably the word was deliberately chosen and has a technical meaning.
Reiko07
Posted: Sunday, January 26, 2020 2:11:25 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 10/30/2018
Posts: 933
Neurons: 4,662
Thanks, FounDit and thar.
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