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down the pub Options
Leid
Posted: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 6:56:22 PM
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How did it go down the pub? Did you have a good time?
What is the purpose of usage of the word "down" in that sentence? One could have said:"how did it go at the pub" as well, right? Has "down" been put in there to indictate the place of the particular pub, below the persons house,for example?
And, is anyone familliar with the possibly vernacular phrase "Ease on down that road"? What is the meaning of it?
I will be genuinely grateful for your answers.
leonAzul
Posted: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 7:32:42 PM

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Leid wrote:
How did it go down the pub? Did you have a good time?
What is the purpose of usage of the word "down" in that sentence? One could have said:"how did it go at the pub" as well, right? Has "down" been put in there to indictate the place of the particular pub, below the persons house,for example?
And, is anyone familliar with the possibly vernacular phrase "Ease on down that road"? What is the meaning of it?
I will be genuinely grateful for your answers.


The word "down" often means in the direction of the center of a town or city. In cities that have numbered streets, "uptown" and "downtown" have an obvious meaning.

I would guess that since most older towns and cities emerged as trading centers, they would be more likely to be situated near a river or port, which would in turn be lower than the surrounding hills and plains. Likewise, agrarian communities would set aside the lowlands for planting fields and build their residences in the hills. In either case, going to town would involve a descent, but that would be conjecture and I make no claim to its factuality.

In AE one would more commonly hear "How did it go down at the pub?" or "Did you make it down to the pub last night?" Perhaps an even better example would be "Im going Down to the Nightclub." Whistle

Both "down" and "up" are often used idiomatically to mean "along" when referring to traveling a road. "Ease on down that road" is a colloquialism for "Don't be anxious or in a hurry to travel".




"Make it go away, Mrs Whatsit," he whispered. "Make it go away. It's evil."
jmacann
Posted: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 8:48:58 PM
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Right -most commonly lower than the surrounding hills and plains. Toledo (Spain) is one exception.

View of Toledo
El Greco

excaelis
Posted: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 9:13:41 PM

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In fact many towns built with defence in mind might be exceptions. Perhaps it has something to do with low company ?

Sanity is not statistical
leonAzul
Posted: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 10:14:10 PM

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jmacann wrote:
Right -most commonly lower than the surrounding hills and plains. Toledo (Spain) is one exception.

excaelis wrote:
In fact many towns built with defence in mind might be exceptions. Perhaps it has something to do with low company ?


Agreed, and long before that there was the Acropolis

Quote:
In many parts of the world, these early citadels became the nuclei of large cities, which grew up on the surrounding lower ground, such as modern Rome.


In the case of cities like Toledo, or the many alpine burgs, the fortifications themselves became self-contained living centers and there was no reason at all to go down to anywhere, except to trade with other cities.

"Make it go away, Mrs Whatsit," he whispered. "Make it go away. It's evil."
Drag0nspeaker
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 4:57:22 AM

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Leid wrote:
How did it go down the pub? Did you have a good time?
What is the purpose of usage of the word "down" in that sentence?


Although I've not been in a pub for a while - to the common British person, "down" (in this case) has the same meaning as "at", "in" or "up".

If it were a walk up a steep hill to the pub, one would not use "down", but if it were pretty level, one would say whichever seemed to fit. British people use "downtown" a lot less that Americans do, though if we go from a suburb to the city, we would commonly say "I went up to London"

NOTE - "down the pub" is conversational English, in anything even slightly more formal you would use "at" or "in" or even "down at"

Wyrd bið ful aræd - bull!
munro66
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 6:18:19 AM
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When it comes to travelling and taking the United Kingdom as an example, if we were going to travel to Scotland would say " We are going up to Scotland" and if we were to visit Cornwall would say "We are going down to Cornwall"

Using the word 'down' for going to Scotland would be entirely out of context and so would 'up' for going to Cornwall.

If we were to travel to Wales, we would go across to Wales.
Visit Ireland, would go over to Ireland [as it would involve travel by boat or plane]

A more regular saying in this household

We also go down to the shops and go up on the hills.M
intelfam
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 6:19:59 AM

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Drag0nspeaker wrote:


If it were a walk up a steep hill to the pub, one would not use "down", but if it were pretty level, one would say whichever seemed to fit. British people use "downtown" a lot less that Americans do, though if we go from a suburb to the city, we would commonly say "I went up to London"


Hadn't thought about the use of "down" when going to a pub, but you are right that, if it is obviously "uphill", folk round here do say "to" the pub.

Don't know what the general usage around "going to London" is. I live just outside the suburbs and we say "up to London" and this usage remains even out as far as Brighton or Dover. However, my family in Lincolnshire (well north of London) and my pals in Peterborough refer to "going down to London". I've always assumed it was because of the orientation on conventional atlases. Wonder what they say in Scotland? Sorry, that's a complete aside, I'm off down the pub (which is, incidentally, at the altitude level as my home)


"The voice of the majority is no proof of justice." - Schiller
Romany
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 6:57:17 AM
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Similarly, one gets "sent down" from University (for AE speakers, this means 'expelled from').

This no longer has anything to do with geography - but once upon a time the "Home" or "Southern" Counties were where all the sons ( Daughters, naturally - with their smaller brains - were not admitted to places of higher learning) of the aristocracy embarked from for their University careers. Oxford and Cambridge for around 700 years, being by default the only towns such families considered as containing Universities.

While families may have had additional properties north of both Oxford and Cambridge, these were mainly used in the hunting season, or as places to store mad or intransigent relatives. The family seat of most of the Right Sort would not have been in the barbarian vastness of the North.

Thus, a student who was not considered University material for whatever reason would be send back down to his family home in disgrace: hence "sent down" from University.
Ray41
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 7:19:28 AM

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Invariably we use the term 'going up town' regardless of its position. We also use 'going down the street'Think .
A judge will most likely 'send you down' if you are guilty,in this context it means 'to gaol'.


Intel wrote:
Hadn't thought about the use of "down" when going to a pub, but you are right that, if it is obviously "uphill", folk round here do say "to" the pub.


Heck intel, thats what I go to the pub for, to 'down' a cold glass of ale,[or three]Dancing

While I live I grow.
Drag0nspeaker
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 7:51:49 AM

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Romany wrote:
The family seat of most of the Right Sort would not have been in the barbarian vastness of the North.

Ah well - since my family were a little off the main stream on the bastard side of things:



(note the red "bend sinister") - we only lived in the north. Mi Dad worked in t'mill an' mi grandad were down t'pit.

"down" in this case was literaly down

Edit: I just noticed the coat of arms does not appear here - but if you right-click on the icon and click "Open in new tab" you can see it. I'll try to do better next time.

Wyrd bið ful aræd - bull!
Jyrkkä Jätkä
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 9:42:07 AM

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Since folks seem to shorten the everyday language:

"Where you going?"
"Pub."


In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.
Alias
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 10:42:33 AM

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Damnation all this chatter about going t'pub has got me all of a thirst like! But I dont think I'll go down pub (note missing "the" as is the norm in The North....everywhere south is down....especially those Posh boogers in London!!

I think instead I will cross the floor to fridge and knock the cap off a cold guiness...thanks to those wonderful brewers "across" the sea in Dublin......

Whilst now I reside down under in the antipodes, in the colonies.
I came down here to Oz as a lad but if I go back it wont be "up" to England...
I prefer Oz, the beer always tastes better when its warm..err the weather not the beer...I am not that much of a Pom!!

Ray 41 wrote: Invariably we use the term 'going up town' regardless of its position. We also use 'going down the street' .
A judge will most likely 'send you down' if you are guilty,in this context it means 'to gaol'
.

BTW Ray... in this (and many other parts of Oz its my experience that it is in fact very variable and the terms down town and uptown are equally as common...but while that judge might send you down he/she might equally send you UP the river...
Literally in the case of Cadell on the Upper Murray..where I worked at one time..err not as a residentg in case thats what you are thinking!! LOL Angel

I think its about time chickens are able to cross the road without constantly having their motives challenged!
Drag0nspeaker
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 1:00:41 PM

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So, if one's co-conspirators sell one down the river, the judge would send you back up again??
http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/sell+down+the+river
Brick wall d'oh!


Wyrd bið ful aræd - bull!
Leid
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 5:18:56 PM
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Many thanks to all! People often say'going down the street','down the hall',river,etc.Which means going along the street,along the hall, along the river. So, I suppose, the words "down" and "along" are interchangeable in these kinds of sentences, is it correct? Or maybe there are some exceptions where you use "along" strictly.I'm speaking about conversational English.
Quote:
Thus, a student who was not considered University material for whatever reason would be send back down to his family home in disgrace: hence "sent down" from University.
Thanks,Romany! It's always good to hear about the etymology of the phrase or a word.Angel
Quote:
NOTE - "down the pub" is conversational English, in anything even slightly more formal you would use "at" or "in" or even "down at"
So "down" is unsuitable but "down at" can be used in formal speech,am I getting you right??
Quote:
Mi Dad worked in t'mill an' mi grandad were down t'pit.
That is an interesting dialect,in which county do folks speak like that?Still can't see the coat of arms(
MGmirkin
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 7:33:59 PM
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Leid wrote:
How did it go down the pub?
Ease on down that road?


The first, it sounds like the speaker left out [at] after 'down', that is "how did it go down [at] the pub?"

If an 'at' was left out, then it makes more sense (to me at least). But even still it might be a case of a dangling participle as it could potentially be read:

How did it go [down at the pub]? (How was your evening? You know, at that place we like...)
-or-
[How did it go down] at the pub? (What was the sequence of events of something that happened? As with a crime committed or a bar fight.)

Otherwise, it must be some local expression or an idiom I'm not familiar with (probably closest to the first of the two options listed immediately above)?

WRT "Ease on down that road," ease on down just means to move down the road or along the road at a leisurely pace (or possibly move down the road carefully, if there are obstacles requiring attention). In that case down just means 'along' or 'in the direction of' the road.

~MG
MGmirkin
Posted: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 7:49:53 PM
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Leid wrote:
NOTE - "down the pub" is conversational English, in anything even slightly more formal you would use "at" or "in" or even "down at"


I'm thinking bordering on slang. And technically 'down' isn't even grammatically correct in that sentence, so it's got to be some local idiom. I'd think that foreshortening the sentence to "at the pub" would be more correct than "down the pub." Though, again, in a specific dialect or situation it may just be that the [at] is implied rather than stated and everyone knows the phrase is actually "down at the pub" but local convention is just to say "down' the pub," leaving out the [at] which everyone just kind of assumes/infers whilst talking out loud in a technically grammatically incorrect manner. ;)

Just wager a guess.

Kind of like shortening "down at the pub" to "down a' the pub" (leaving off the harsh 't' consonant sound of 'at'; sounds Irish?) to just "down' the pub" (not even bothering with the soft 'a' vowel sound of 'at' and dropping the 'at' altogether).

Sorry, brain wasn't firing on all cylinders earlier. I'm guessing that's probably what happened there. Shortened once, shortened twice. Now makes no grammatical sense, but everyone still knows by implication what was originally meant.

~MG

P.S. If it were an Irish (or Scottish) invention it would probably sound more like "Hoo'd i' go doon' th' pub." Only mostly kidding... ;)
Romany
Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2011 12:14:47 AM
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Dragonspeaker
'Mi Dad worked in t'mill an' mi grandad were down t'pit.' Oh aye. An' did your family live in a shoebox in't'bottom of a lake?

Leid -
Dragonspeaker was reproducing the dialect spoken in some places in the north of England...and much parodied. My response refers, in fact, to a well-known comedy skit which does exactly this.

But, speaking like this, you can imagine why no-one ever considered that anyone at all would go 'down' to attend Oxford or Cambridge!! (And that, too, is merely a joke).

Leid
Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2011 12:39:32 PM
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Quote:
[How did it go down] at the pub? (What was the sequence of events of something that happened? As with a crime committed or a bar fight.)
Hm, didn't think of that.Think Just one more little question:what does the phrases "to be down for"(I'm down for you), and "to be down with" mean?The latter doesn't mean "to do away with" or "get rid of".I think there has to be some other definition,but I don't know what is it.
Quote:
If it were an Irish (or Scottish) invention it would probably sound more like "Hoo'd i' go doon' th' pub."
Ay, atweill)
leonAzul
Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2011 2:25:46 PM

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Leid wrote:
Just one more little question:what does the phrases "to be down for"(I'm down for you), and "to be down with" mean?The latter doesn't mean "to do away with" or "get rid of".I think there has to be some other definition,but I don't know what is it.


The expressions "to be down with" (more common) and "to be down for" mean "to subscribe to". For example, "I'm down for you" could mean "Consider me to be on your list of supporters."

You are correct that there is a similar idiom "Down with!" used almost exclusively imperatively to express the wish to bring something down or get rid of it.

Oddly enough "to be up for" is not the opposite, but means "to be in the mood for".

"Make it go away, Mrs Whatsit," he whispered. "Make it go away. It's evil."
excaelis
Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2011 4:41:31 PM

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I just thought this thread needed a theme song...

I Got Friends In Low Places

Sanity is not statistical
MGmirkin
Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2011 10:00:23 PM
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Leid wrote:
Just one more little question:what does the phrases "to be down for"(I'm down for you), and "to be down with" mean?The latter doesn't mean "to do away with" or "get rid of".I think there has to be some other definition,but I don't know what is it.


Well, amusingly, "to be down for" and "to be up for" basically mean the same thing.

Colloquialism meaning "to be willing to do X"

I'm down for surfing: "I'm willing to go surfing."
I'm up for surfing: "I'm willing to go surfing."

I'm not sure how it came about... I'm GUESSING (again) that it may have come from the notion of signing up for something, as in an activity at camp or in some other setting that requires signing up?

As in "put me down for soccer in the afternoon" (that is write down my name for activity X to sign me up as interested in participating).

Similarly, one can then also be said to be 'signed up' for the activity. Maybe a tenuous link (at best). But, sort of make pseudo-sense.

More so with being 'down for' something. As, when queried whether one has written down their name for an activity, one might point at the list and say "I'm down for it" (as in my name has been "written down" to signify I'm interested). Just guessing that MAY be where it came from.

But, regardless, these days it's just a more general signifier of being willing to participate in some suggested activity, or even, without being queried, to suggest an idea to a friend or group.

As in "I'm up for lunch, who's with me?" or "I'm down for a game of volley ball, [do] you guys want to play [too]?"
MGmirkin
Posted: Thursday, October 13, 2011 10:08:25 PM
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Also, in some cases to "go down" or "go up" somewhere can mean in terms of north & south on a map.

Like I went down to Eugene, Oregon for school (University of Oregon) and went up to Tacoma, Washington to visit my mother. (Being situated north of Eugene but south of Tacoma, I'd have to go north to Tacoma and south to Eugene; generally, up and down respectively on a map, assuming one orients north toward the top and south toward the bottom.)

I wonder, do Aussies have the same expressions or are they reversed? Mostly kidding, but a little bit not...?
NancyUK
Posted: Friday, October 14, 2011 8:50:20 AM

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Using this informal construction is common in the UK, although in my experience it tends to be associated with "working class" activities. (BTW the quotes are there to indicate my view that the term working class is dubious in nature, not as sneer quotes, which I have been accused of in the past!)

So you would hear someone say they went down the pub, down the dogs (greyhound racing) or down the chippy (fish and chips takeaway BE or takeout AE) but you are unlikely to hear anyone say they went down the opera or down the art gallery!

Having said that, to say you are going down the pub is widespread and not confined to any walk of life.

From the Cambridge Dictionary online (under pub, not down!)

Do you want to go to/informal go down the pub after work?

From the Oxford Dictionary online:

informal at or to (a place):she was tired of going down the pub every night

From the MacMillan Dictionary online:

Usage note: down
In informal British spoken English down is sometimes used without the preposition ‘to’ or ‘at’ when talking about a place that is near you: He’s down the pub with his mates. But many people think this is not correct.


I would live all my life in nonchalance and insouciance, Were it not for making a living, which is rather a nouciance. Ogden Nash
Leid
Posted: Friday, October 14, 2011 11:47:06 AM
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excaelis wrote:
I just thought this thread needed a theme song...

I Got Friends In Low Places

That's a good one, excaelisApplause
Quote:
but you are unlikely to hear anyone say they went down the opera or down the art gallery!
Why,that could be words of a guy from "tha hood" who has surprisingly fast moved up a social ledder and his vocabulary doesn't seem to keep up with his present status, like Ali G in that movie..
Thank you all for clarification,I really appreciate itAngel .
Peaceward
Posted: Friday, October 14, 2011 12:22:19 PM
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May it be simply in that concrete sentence a word -down- mean that he/she has never been in a pub and asked how does it feel to has been in a pub for 1st time during entire life which is far off the walking down the pub?

What goes around, comes around.
tootsie
Posted: Friday, October 14, 2011 12:45:27 PM

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http://youtu.be/kM0Neo85Rj4

I'm not lost for I know where I am. But however, where I am may be lost. Winnie-the-Pooh
Leid
Posted: Friday, October 14, 2011 1:33:59 PM
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It is highly unlikely that the word "down" itself can convey that meaning.It depends on context, whether the person was in the pub for the first time and was asked about his(or her)impression of the place or he(or she) was merely asked out of politeness, because that person could be a habitual drinker and could know that certain pub better than his own appartment.
Quote:
which is far off the walking down the pub?
You mean that the road to the pub is too long and the person's house is situated in some village without any infrastructure so he can't get to the pub by bus and he doesn't have a car(because there are no roads)Whistle and that's why he has never been there? That is topical for many Russian villages so the locals have to make samogon(selfmade vodka)."Down" implies walking or driving to the place(just beacause you can't snap your fingers and find yourself sitting across the bartender immediately). Actually the meaning of the sentence is obvious and I think you are overanalysing it. It is the word "down" which is confusing.You should read the thread.The guys have explained it far better then I would do.
Peaceward
Posted: Friday, October 14, 2011 1:58:07 PM
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I meant that two have never been in a pub because of their way of life, habits, social status and they do not walk, go, drive to the pub doesn't matter so they wonder maybe down for them is like a fall from their level below, just another view

What goes around, comes around.
Leid
Posted: Friday, October 14, 2011 4:07:06 PM
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OK,I get it now.In that case the answer is definitely 'no'."Down" in that sentence cannot mean what you have described.
excaelis
Posted: Friday, October 14, 2011 4:17:36 PM

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Speaking of Oxford and Cambridge ( albeit in a dictionarial [ ? ] context ) when one is attending classes at either of those august institutions one is said to be up. When one is expelled one is sent down. If one is not physically in attendance ( though still a student ) one is down, yet still up. Clear ?

Sanity is not statistical
Peaceward
Posted: Friday, October 14, 2011 4:47:23 PM
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With big striving I believe that I,v understood...and is it true that "down" may have a tint in meaning on "baseness" something inferior?

What goes around, comes around.
excaelis
Posted: Friday, October 14, 2011 4:53:44 PM

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It can do, yes. It's one of those words in English that has a multitude of meanings that are all completely context-dependent. I'm lucky I'm a native speaker, so don't have to figure them out as I go !

Sanity is not statistical
Peaceward
Posted: Friday, October 14, 2011 5:09:28 PM
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Thanks excaelis I guessed so, and though I thought your answers cost much :) thanks again

What goes around, comes around.
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