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You must be logged in to do that/must log in to do that[a passive/active form] Options
A cooperator
Posted: Tuesday, November 07, 2017 8:25:56 PM

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Hi,

Which should I use, the active form or passive form?
You must be logged in to do that, or you must login to do that.



Sometimes I see 'You must login or create a free account to make posts' while trying adding a new post to my thread while I am not logged in to a forum account of mine.
In other times, while I am logged in to a forum account of mine, and doing some edits, I see this error notification when trying saving the changes.
You must be logged in to do that.

Whoever doesn't own what he promises to those who do not deserve must not promise it.
palapaguy
Posted: Tuesday, November 07, 2017 9:55:56 PM

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They mean the same thing for practical purposes, although the passive form is a bit more common, in my experience.
palapaguy
Posted: Tuesday, November 07, 2017 10:48:30 PM

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palapaguy wrote:
They mean the same thing for practical purposes, although the passive form is a bit more common, in my experience.

A related question: Is "login" a verb? Seems wrong to me, but ...
rroselavy
Posted: Wednesday, November 08, 2017 2:03:30 AM

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"Login" is correct for the noun (username); "log in" for the verb. Similarly "setup" (noun), "set up" (verb); "slowdown" (noun), "slow down" (verb); "buyout" (noun), "buy out" (verb), etc.
A cooperator
Posted: Friday, November 10, 2017 5:47:14 PM

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Joined: 10/27/2011
Posts: 2,331
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Location: Ḩāḑírah, Hadramawt, Yemen
rroselavy wrote:
"Login" is correct for the noun (username); "log in" for the verb. Similarly "setup" (noun), "set up" (verb); "slowdown" (noun), "slow down" (verb); "buyout" (noun), "buy out" (verb), etc.

Thank you both of you.
Although it is not the question in the thread in discussion, I remember that I read somewhere that if such verbs, setup, login, slowdown are being used in the base(infinitive) form of a verb, then we can say 'login, setup, slowdown', 'buyout', etc. as verbs or nouns.

Whoever doesn't own what he promises to those who do not deserve must not promise it.
A cooperator
Posted: Friday, November 10, 2017 6:02:37 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 10/27/2011
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Location: Ḩāḑírah, Hadramawt, Yemen
palapaguy wrote:
They mean the same thing for practical purposes, although the passive form is a bit more common, in my experience.


Thanks a lot,
I don't think the passive form, which requires someone/something to do the action, and the active form, which itself does the action, are the same thing.
You must login to do that.
You must be logged in [by something] to do that. => Something must log you in to do that.

Whoever doesn't own what he promises to those who do not deserve must not promise it.
Audiendus
Posted: Friday, November 10, 2017 7:55:09 PM
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"You must be logged in" is not a passive form. It refers to the state of having logged in, not the action of logging in. So "you must be logged in" means "you must already be logged in"; it implies "you must have logged in". "Logged in" is adjectival here.

You have used "logged in" in this sense yourself, in your phrase "while I am logged in".
A cooperator
Posted: Saturday, November 18, 2017 4:12:27 PM

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Location: Ḩāḑírah, Hadramawt, Yemen
Audiendus wrote:
"You must be logged in" is not a passive form. It refers to the state of having logged in, not the action of logging in. So "you must be logged in" means "you must already be logged in"; it implies "you must have logged in". "Logged in" is adjectival here.

You have used "logged in" in this sense yourself, in your phrase "while I am logged in".


Thanks a lot, Audiendus,
Here is the key of my issue, which is how to distinguish if a past participle is functioning as a passivized verb or an adjective?
You only decided on saying 'logged in/logged out/ are NOT passive forms here, but are adjectival. But, if there are other verbs followed instead of 'logged in', then how could I have distinguished they are functioning as adjectival?
I used 'While I am logged in [by something]' since I was expecting 'logged in' is functioning as a passivized verb here.

Whoever doesn't own what he promises to those who do not deserve must not promise it.
Audiendus
Posted: Saturday, November 18, 2017 9:21:29 PM
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Posts: 4,430
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Location: London, England, United Kingdom
A cooperator wrote:
Here is the key of my issue, which is how to distinguish if a past participle is functioning as a passivized verb or an adjective?
You only decided on saying 'logged in/logged out/ are NOT passive forms here, but are adjectival. But, if there are other verbs followed instead of 'logged in', then how could I have distinguished they are functioning as adjectival?

You need to consider the context. Does it refer to an action taking place at that time? If so, it is a passive form. Or does it refer to a state resulting from an earlier action? If so, it is adjectival. Examples:

As soon as everyone had come out, the door was locked. [Refers to an action; someone locked the door at that moment. Passive.]
I could not get in, because the door was locked. [Refers to a state; someone had locked the door before my arrival. Adjectival.]

A cooperator wrote:
I used 'While I am logged in [by something]' since I was expecting 'logged in' is functioning as a passivized verb here.

No, if it were a passivized verb it would mean "during the action of logging in". What you actually mean is "after the action of logging in", i.e. "when I am already logged in". It refers to a state (of being already logged in), and is therefore adjectival.
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