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I am a Catholic. I served my church for almost half of my life. Then suddenly, temptation comes and gets me to be involved in such an act that I didn't really approve of in the first place. But I allow myself to do it. I'm very sad because I'm a hypocrite.
I know that we all have different beliefs. But how do you define premarital sex? Is it really that bad with regard to religion?
Thank you guys in advance.
Look within and face the world. In the mirror of relationships are secrets to be unfurled. Wherever you go, there you are. You are fearless -Deepak Chopra
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Hi~Casper,
I'm not a Catholic, and I'm not sure if I can give you any reasonable advice.
As a woman to a woman talk, I think it's the baseline that you've set for yourself. You need to be pretty sure what your baseline is (eg., never be a thief no matter how poor you are is your baseline; under this baseline you will never steal!) .
I have a close friend from Myanmar. She's not a Catholic but premarital sex is forbidden in her culture. Here comes the question: She's an adult and two years before she came to other country for her study. There, she met a boyfriend which was pretty nice to her. Her "Yes or No" bothered them pretty much and their relationship was once in tense.
She even couldn't describe if they did it or not. And after the vague experience, she blamed herself and worried about pregancy. As her close friend, I could understand her feeling. To reduce her worries, we counted the safe period, and tried to figure out the conflicts and shock which was against her culture.
She told me that she would never ever do that again because the feeling was pretty bad. The baseline or frame of her is limited to certain level of intimacy. Once it was crossed over, she felt bad. If the feeling towards passionate is an unhappy one, I recommended her to hold on her belief. No matter how romantic the atmosphere is, she has the right to say NO. That was her case.
It would be another situation if she felt shy, shame, but also blissful or happy. If the feeling of their love would be more reliable after the affair, I think she could have the freedom of doing what she feels right.
Culture is a big umberlla. It should be respected under the way that one is not being struggled. Once the rain stops, you have the right to step out of your umberlla. :)
Fill your paper with the breathings of your heart. ~William Wordsworth
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A thoughtful question, Casper. I appreciate.
My religion also forbids pre-marital sex. For any matter related to this and other matters as well, I feel that it is good to abide by the customs of religion. If everybody is given liberty to do anything they want, it will be a mess. A society must follow some order.
If you have courage to go against the stream, you can, but if you regret, it is better to follow the stream.
We are responsible for what we are, and whatever we wish ourselves to be, we have the power to make ourselves. ~ Swami Vivekanand
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Assuming you are a Hindu, Hinduism forbids pre- marital sex? Society does in a many places but I didn't know that about Hinduism.
The world makes way for the man who knows where he is going. ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Yes Rusty, I am a Hindu, and Hinduism forbids pre-marital sex. Do you have any doubt or query?
We are responsible for what we are, and whatever we wish ourselves to be, we have the power to make ourselves. ~ Swami Vivekanand
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As far as I know (which is, admittedly, little), Hinduism doesn't forbid 'pre-marital sex' in so many words, but our Vedas have quite eloquently demarcated our lives into the 4 ashramas, in which the Brahmacharya quarter pertains to acquiring knowledge, and the Grihastha is for marital duties and pleasures. So, usually the Brahmachaaris (the people in the Brahmacharya ashrama) are expected to abstain from the sensual pleasures.
वसुधैव कुटुम्बकं - हितोपदेश The world is my family.- Hitopadesh
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ludic wrote:As far as I know (which is, admittedly, little), Hinduism doesn't forbid 'pre-marital sex' in so many words, but our Vedas have quite eloquently demarcated our lives into the 4 ashramas, in which the Brahmacharya quarter pertains to acquiring knowledge, and the Grihastha is for marital duties and pleasures. So, usually the Brahmachaaris (the people in the Brahmacharya ashrama) are expected to abstain from the sensual pleasures.  Can you provide some reference for that? My studies and knowledge say something different.
We are responsible for what we are, and whatever we wish ourselves to be, we have the power to make ourselves. ~ Swami Vivekanand
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I do not mean to refute any point you make, srirr, but it will surely be easier for you to reference your assertion of some proscription against pre-marital sex in the Hindu religion from your studies and knowledge, instead of me referencing a source claiming it's absence; because I am certainly not well-versed in our scriptures, and it's also a bit unrealistic to imagine citing a source that lists things not present in the religion.
वसुधैव कुटुम्बकं - हितोपदेश The world is my family.- Hitopadesh
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Looking at the walls of some temples (Khajuraho, e.g) it certainly doesn't seem that pre-marital sex was a taboo back then. Surely that horse wasn't married to that gent...
In this world there is no literate population that is poor and no illiterate population that is other than poor. - J.K.Galbraith
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In my religion pre-marital sex is highly frowned upon. Looked upon as one of the most greivous sins one can commit.
I think if you believe that pre-marital sex is a sin, then you will feel bad if you engage in it.
Many people think pre-marital sex should be the norm and completely acceptable, but only you can set your standards.
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I don't know, there seems to be no clear endorsing of it I agree, but then I also don't know if it is clearly forbidden.
The world makes way for the man who knows where he is going. ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson
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@ srirr:
As for the queries, are you well versed in Hindu scriptures or have some qualification? Though am not religious, there are a lot of things I would like to know but don't know whom to ask. If you and some others can help then I can create another thread for the purpose and ask some questions, that is, if there isn't such a thread already.
The world makes way for the man who knows where he is going. ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson
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OK while you guys in India go off on a debate about Hinduism Casper is asking for help, not a lesson in comparative religions.
Dear Casper please dont fret. I understand that your God is a forgiving God....so be forgiven!.....I am sure your God does not want to see you suffer..if he/she does want you to totrture yourself then maybe its time for a rethink!...
No I am confident that the Christian God (Jesus) is compassionate, understanding, wise forgiving and is not out to hurt you and wouldnt want you to torment yourself with feelings of guilt.
We all err, to err (make a mistake) is human...to forgive is divine! ...
Ok that is how i see your predicament from a Christian perspective Casper.
This is how I see it from my own world view:
To love is neither a crime or a sin.....to hold and comfort one another is a joy and should be practiced at every opportunity. There is far too much talk and rules and not enough hugging and kissing. There are many many many definitions of what constitutes sex....
I am not going to go in to that here and add to your embarassment, however I would suggest that eros is a natural function of human life....and can be one of the most beautiful expressions of what it means to be human. Raw lust can also be fun but lacks the intimacy of eros.
Jesus doesnt mention sex and pre-marital sex at all from my reading of the New Testament. Jesus said that the law is superceded by the spirit! The laws of the Old Testament (essentially a series of books taken from The Jewish religion are a guide for living to avoid pitfalls. The real damage of pre-marital sex is not that you have made love physically with another human being.
If you:
Took precautions and avoided the likelihood of unwanted conception.
Took precautions to ensure that you did not become infected with STI's
Did not have a covert relationship with someone otherwise attached to someone else.
If you did not use fraud, trickery, coercion or other means to enlist the other person in having sex without genuine consent.
Unfortunatley in many societies, and especially The Philipines which is so deeply entrenched in Catholocism, the issue of others finding out and judging you is your biggest hurdle.
(Judge not lest ye also shall be judged..and let him who is without sin cast the first stone...Remember Jesus best friend was Mary Magdalene a woman who was judged by religious folks)
Being judged is probably one of the most serious harms that can happen...Ostracism, labelling and discrimination could have awful effects on you.
But I beg you not to punish yourself.
Then where is the real harm?.......I think that the real harm is in allowing guilt to eat at you. Allowing guilt to undermine your simple act of human love and affection.
ook at the positives...it will deepen your understanding of others and deepen your compassion for others that may find the stringency of the rules are not always in conjunct with the human heart.
Good Luck Casper and stay safe. Warm forgiving friends and people who dont sit in judgement of others or become self righteous make the best company and in my mind the best people....
Join the club...(smiles)
A Genie told me I could have one wish...Either a large Penis or a Long memory...I forget which one I chose. :)
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Alias, that was some human aspect well put! 
I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
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Thanks JJ....Has the snow melted there yet?
A Genie told me I could have one wish...Either a large Penis or a Long memory...I forget which one I chose. :)
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To avoid pre-marital sex makes sense only if you are 100% sure that you would marry one day.
Brain-washing starts in the cradle. - Arthur Koestler
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Would you buy a car without test driving it? Why would you marry someone without knowing if you're sexually compatible? Marriage is supposedly forever...that's longer than we keep any car. The nonsense about some 'special blessing upon the marriage bed' is exactly that: nonsense.
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Alias wrote:Thanks JJ....Has the snow melted there yet?
Yes, it looks like this right now:  Talking about the premarital sex: Sex is a synonym to making love. You need love to have sex. Do you ask priests or any other people to give acceptance to who you love?
I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
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Quote:Do you ask priests or any other people to give acceptance to who you love? family...When we were young(I mean younger than now), we tend to ignore parents' advices. Sometimes, they might know our blind sides which we haven't noticed. I totally agree that judgement is harmful. No need to think more about what has happened. Just let go...and relax... Take care, Casper. Stay clam, brave, and wise for the coming 2013, 2014... :)
Fill your paper with the breathings of your heart. ~William Wordsworth
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To Jyrkka Jatka:
I love your picture of the forest. I was unable to comment on the winter pictures you posted. The snow is beautiful in Finland.
P.S.To All: Love and sex has been here for a long, long time. It can't be so terribly bad before marriage. I'm too sleepy to write more. Hopefully I will continue my response tomorrow.
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I suppose this depends on what you make of both sex and religion -commonly rather overrated, anyway; love stands by itself, and must be a part of them both.
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Alias, 
What a lovely post. 
We do need more hugs in this world. 
>^,,^<
The poor object to being governed badly, whilst the rich object to being governed at all. G.K. Chesterton
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thank you for all your comments--nice comments actually. I know that God will forgive me, but I have the tendency to keep doing it. But is it truly a sin? What does it say in your Bible? or Koran? I'm really afraid. I guess I'm gonna take all of your advices, and next week I'll try asking a priest...
Look within and face the world. In the mirror of relationships are secrets to be unfurled. Wherever you go, there you are. You are fearless -Deepak Chopra
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To Casper: The question really is not what WE (the forum members) think, but what YOU think.
Each of us has our own thoughts about such things. And all of us, I’m sure, are happy to share with you these thoughts. But only you can determine for yourself what is morally right or wrong for you.
Trust your own perceptions and in what your own sense of right IS. Perhaps you will find later that you made a mistake and come to a different conclusion about what is right for you. This happens to all of us. This is how we grow as human beings. As our perspective changes so do we-- IF what we realize comes from within our own self. Otherwise you are pretty much a puppet that religions and other people manipulate and control. And, you cannot really say that YOU are amoral being.
Do not fear being judged; you always will be no matter what you do.
If you ask a priest, he will tell you what he is suppose to tell you. Which is: what you did is wrong; and, fall upon God’s mercy and ask for his forgiveness. Your penance will be something like: say ten Our Fathers and twenty Hail Marys. Or, he might assign to you the recitation of the rosary….He may even suggest that you call upon God’s strength to help you resist temptation. AND--he will most likely tell you you must relinquish the person you are having sex with...Are you willing to--or CAN you do that? What he is NOT going to tell you is that sex before marriage is okay. Nor is he going to tell you to think for yourself. But for you to truly receive the sacrament of penance, you truly need to believe what you did was wrong, and truly feel remorseful for what you did--Not because you are fearful of going to hell.
So… you are back to the question only you can answer: Do YOU believe sex before marriage is a sin? If so, are you sorry for it? If not, you might want to consider Alias’s response and many of the other responses that you have received and meditate on them for a while.
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aerie wrote:Would you buy a car without test driving it? Why would you marry someone without knowing if you're sexually compatible? Marriage is supposedly forever...that's longer than we keep any car. The nonsense about some 'special blessing upon the marriage bed' is exactly that: nonsense.
This is a tired, hackneyed argument that is based on a false analogy. Give me a break. I could just as well make up another completely irrelevant analogy to support the exact opposite idea. I'll just do it right now off the top of my head, OK? Would you buy a bag of potato chips without opening it in the store first to see what they taste like? We could make up false analogies all day, but it's pointless.
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I think a very real question comes to my mind while reading this thread. How do you deal with guilt you feel when you have crossed a moral line in your own life? I can not but think that most of us have done that at sometime or another. I bet most of us still feel regret and remorse. I personally believe in a forgiving God. I am thankful for Jesus who knows our temptations and understands our faults. My best advice to you is to dust yourself off. Resolve not to get so carried away that you cross lines and try to understand how it was that you were tempted in the first place. All our lusts come from within our own hearts. Don't throw away the morals you have been taught just because you weren't strong enough to resist this time. No one ever thinks a baby will never learn to walk just because he fell down the first time. Be kinder to yourself in your self criticism so you won't become dejected and give up hope on yourself. Best wishes for a happy life.
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Greetings Casper,
How goes it. Premarital sex is a sin as indicted by the Creator of the Universe. But let's face it, it's not the only sin that we commit on a day-to-day basis right. Any disobedient act is an outward manifestation of where one's true loyalty is: to another authority we deem higher than another. So in this case, our own authority. "Obedience" is then an outward manifestation of our love, faith and loyalty to a particular authority. In the case of Catholics/a.k.a. Christians, that authority is God : The Father, The Son & The Holy Ghost (material for another discussion I'm sure). If we deliberately choose to do what "that still small voice" (the Holy Spirit indwelling us) is advising/ reminding us is wrong, then we are sinning; we are deliberately putting ourselves at odds with Christ. Though He is always willing to forgive, should we not then be willing to repent and turn from our sin? Or, should we continue to sin knowing He will forgive us and just relegate Christ our Saviour as our butler who's sole purpose in our lives is to just come and clean up the mud we track through our lives with disregard? Our actions do speak louder than our words. Temptation is not sin until we've given in to it. If we are weak, then it is on Christ - who also knew thirst, hunger, loneliness and temptation while He walked among us - that we should lean on for our strength to resist the temptations in our lives. Our devotion, our thankfulness, our gratitude, our love is best manifested, expressed in the lives we live.
It is the heart of man that God desires be turned to Him.
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I think almost all religions discourage pre-marital sex. It may be because of some moral and ethical reason. But there must be some psychological reasons also behind this taboo. Do you think that pre-marital sex may adversely affect one's psyche; if it does then why? I mean to say that only that person will feel remorse after doing pre-marital sex who believes in some religion. A person who is an atheist or who does not believe in any religion or life hereafter or day of judgement may not feel any regret or remorese after passing through this 'pain of too much tenderness'.
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Buying a car, or potato chips was mentioned earlier. Indeed, they are false analogies.
I hope mine is better: Only after the blessings and the hoopla comes the discovery that one partner prefers spicy food and the other is allergic to it. Will they daily (or three times a week) eat the same food, any which kind?
Brain-washing starts in the cradle. - Arthur Koestler
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In Elizabethan England there were 4 or 5 forms of marriage that were considered societally and legally acceptable, and none of them involved a church. Marriage is not a religious institution but a social one, and the ceremony's purpose is to assure the peer group that the couple is prepared to participate in ( and follow the conventions of ) the group.
Many ' religious ' proscriptions are in fact societal in nature : The Ten Commandments, for example, are an excellent set of guidelines for group living - if one chooses not to regard them as divine their societal utility is undiminished.
Proscriptions against pre-marital sex are, likewise, bulwarks against disorder. Co-operative human society requires order to function effectively - bringing down large prey requires co-ordination and structure, as does farming, industry etc.
Pre-marital sex can be regarded as a threat to established norms and is therefore discouraged.
I do feel on the one hand that if one wishes to be a member of a specific religion then one should not try to pick and choose which rules one wishes to follow - if you don't like the game, either don't play or design your own.
That being said, religious and civil lines are so blurred in many societies that it is next to impossible to draw any kind of line between them, and the social cost of transgressing religious rules is often greater than that of transgressing civil codes.
Casper, I don't envy you your dilemma. But God knows your heart, which I am sure is good, and it is to him not man that you owe allegiance. Read St. Augustine, a great man who suffered the same kind of doubt and guilt as you. It'll help. Namaste.
Sanity is not statistical
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Just reading your original question on this forum, I know you are on the right path.
Off to Singapore for a spell!
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Hi Casper,
I'm an inactive Born-again Christian. Pre-marital sex is a sin but I'm not saying that you can't get intimate and you should shun giving and receiving human affection. I'd be a hypocrite if I say I don't want it, too. But you are the captain of your own ship. It's up to you if you want to yield to temptation. I do not judge those who do premarital sex, but I still believe there are lots of ways to show how you love a person other than sex. Now I just hope not all men have this "test driving a car" ideology  
Ako ay ako, ikaw ay ikaw.
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jeans&sneakers wrote:Now I just hope not all men have this "test driving a car" ideology Conversely, I just hope more women will adopt that ideology....
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Parking lot!! I don't park my car in some garage.. don't want my car to get rust.   Well said jeans&sneakers
If I die, I forgive you, if I recover, we shall see
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-****I am a Catholic. I served my church for almost half of my life. Then suddenly, temptation comes and gets me to be involved in such an act that I didn't really approve of in the first place. But I allow myself to do it. I'm very sad because I'm a hypocrite.
I know that we all have different beliefs. But how do you define premarital sex? Is it really that bad with regard to religion?
Thank you guys in advance.****
Premarital SEX is wrong in many ways. But, I didnt consider it as a MISTAKE. Having sex with the one you love OK as long as you respect each other. You just let him/her feel that he's the only one that you have. ABORTION and DIVORCE is WORST than premarital SEX
You can do anything, but not everything. —David Allen
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