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Advanced learners: Did someone insult you? Options
TheParser
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:30:32 AM
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NOT A TEACHER

Dear Advanced Learners:

Here is an expression that you may occasionally read.

*****

Did someone insult you at school, work, or at a party?
Were you so shocked that you could not answer?
But did you think of a perfect reply later? (When you were no longer near that rude person?)

Well, the French have a term for that kind of situation: l'esprit d'escalier.

Some English writers use that phrase occasionally, for English does not seem to have a good term to describe that situation.

"l'esprit d'escalier" translates as "staircase wit."

In simple English, it means that the idea for a perfect reply to an insult comes too late to your mind in order for you to use it. (The bad guy/gal is no longer around.)


P.S. On the Web, however, there is no problem. If some rude individual posts an insulting remark to you, you can take all the time that you want before replying with the perfect insult in return. I personally, however, never reply to rude netizens. I ignore them.
Jyrkkä Jätkä
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:45:39 AM

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http://forum.thefreedictionary.com/postst149524_Have-you-been-insulted-.aspx


In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.
Romany
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 8:25:57 AM
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Brick wall Brick wall
Gary98
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 9:36:44 AM

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Good memory!

Obviously this phrase is worthy to be repeated. I will forget about it one hour later, and need another reminder.
almo 1
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 9:49:27 AM
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Location: Fussa, Tokyo, Japan



"It's hilarious a lot of times.

You have a conversation with someone,

and he's like, 'You speak so well!'

I'm like, 'What do you mean?

Do you understand that's an insult?"




- Jay Z -



towan52
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 10:12:44 AM

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Déjà vu is always better second time around! d'oh!

'War is God's way of teaching Americans geography!'
will
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 11:11:58 AM
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Classic! Applause

Does l'esprit d'escalier also apply to passive aggressive retorts in the form of lessons in vocabulary?


.
Ashwin Joshi
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 11:14:59 AM

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No, none ever.

Me Gathering Pebbles at the Beach..-Aj
TMe
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 12:04:35 PM

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Nobody has the power to insult you if you have power to earn honor, respect,esteem, value, reverence, honesty and attitude.

Deliberate practice of one hour is worth ten hours of normal practice.
TMe
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 12:28:25 PM

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Nobody has the power to insult you if you have power to earn honor, respect,esteem, value, reverence, honesty and attitude.

Deliberate practice of one hour is worth ten hours of normal practice.
tunaafi
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 12:41:59 PM

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will wrote:
Does l'esprit d'escalier also apply to passive aggressive retorts in the form of lessons in vocabulary?


That's probably too subtle for people who appear to be coming off their meds again.


Far away is close at hand in images of elsewhere – The Master of Paddington.
TheParser
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 1:51:56 PM
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Jyrkkä Jätkä wrote:




Thank you for the link.

I do not know how to link.

I do not know how to find my past posts, either.
TheParser
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 1:53:30 PM
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Gary98 wrote:





Obviously this phrase is worthy to be repeated. [/quote]


Thank you.
TheParser
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 1:54:25 PM
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towan52 wrote:
Déjà vu is always better second time around! d'oh!



I agree.
TheParser
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 1:55:20 PM
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Ashwin Joshi wrote:
No, none ever.



Thank you.
TheParser
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 1:57:19 PM
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TMe wrote:
Nobody has the power to insult you if you have power to earn honor, respect,esteem, value, reverence, honesty and attitude.



So true!

Wilmar (USA)
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 2:09:56 PM

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I would suggest that we don't encourage anyone to deliver insults, regardless of the situation. There is nothing to be gained from it. You only end up looking a fool.
TheParser
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 2:13:32 PM
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Wilmar (USA) wrote:
You only end up looking a fool.



True.
Hope123
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 5:25:55 PM

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Gosh, I can only think of about ten times that someone has tried to insult me here on the Forum. I will have to try harder! Whistle Whistle Whistle

It took a while but I decided it can only be an insult if you take it that way - and have learned to toughen up my skin. (Not promising anything, though. Whistle I might still reply, perhaps using humor.) The wisdom is prevailing that says considering the source of ANY news is helpful.

So I decided I AM "nice" and do not "need to be put in my place". Angel (Newbies - this is an "in" joke.)

Sometimes the longest way around is the shortest way home. Anon
dave argo
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 6:11:28 PM

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TheParser wrote: "But did you think of a perfect reply later?".... "l'esprit d'escalier" translates as "staircase wit."
The perfect explanation for the French expression is that such altercations usually take place while one is climbing and the other descending
in the staircase. Worse than being taken aback and lost for words is the clumsy riposte.

While on a trip to another European country, I seem to remember a late retort being cleverly compared with a delayed fall of a coin
in the public phone, the click that took too long to connect.
Hope123
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 6:14:18 PM

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dave argo wrote:
TheParser wrote: "But did you think of a perfect reply later?".... "l'esprit d'escalier" translates as "staircase wit."
The perfect explanation for the French expression is that such altercations usually take place while one is climbing and the other descending
in the staircase. Worse than being taken aback and lost for words is the clumsy riposte.

While on a trip to another European country, I seem to remember a late retort being cleverly compared with a delayed fall of a coin
in the public phone, the click that took too long to connect.


Thanks for the explanation, Dave. The term makes sense now as I can picture two on the escalator! Or stairs.

Sometimes the longest way around is the shortest way home. Anon
tunaafi
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 7:11:11 PM

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Hope123 wrote:
So I decided I AM "nice" and do not "need to be put in my place".


If I were not so unctuously humble and grovellingly respectful of the aromatic and divine fairer sex, I might timidly (and with the greatest of respect) suggest that all women, in the deepest recesses of their hearts, yearn for a return to the wonderful times when their proper role in life was suitably respected. How many suffering women these days, I wonder, battered by the liberal-leftie tyranny, secretly wish to hurl back the so-called 'right to a mind of your own' and don the hallowed apron of the divine wife and mother?

Try not to give in to the bullies, Hope. We understand your repressed urge to recapture your rightful realm - the kitchen, nursery and bedroom. Let these be your slogans:

Lie back for your rights! Cook for contentment! Suckle for success! Sew for sanity! Stand by/Lie under/lie for/kowtow to your man!.






Far away is close at hand in images of elsewhere – The Master of Paddington.
almo 1
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 8:58:18 PM
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Location: Fussa, Tokyo, Japan


Monday morning quarterback






One who criticizes or passes judgment from a position of hindsight.





Hope123
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 9:29:22 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 3/23/2015
Posts: 5,365
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Location: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
tunaafi wrote:
Hope123 wrote:
So I decided I AM "nice" and do not "need to be put in my place".


If I were not so unctuously humble and grovellingly respectful of the aromatic and divine fairer sex, I might timidly (and with the greatest of respect) suggest that all women, in the deepest recesses of their hearts, yearn for a return to the wonderful times when their proper role in life was suitably respected. How many suffering women these days, I wonder, battered by the liberal-leftie tyranny, secretly wish to hurl back the so-called 'right to a mind of your own' and don the hallowed apron of the divine wife and mother?

Try not to give in to the bullies, Hope. We understand your repressed urge to recapture your rightful realm - the kitchen, nursery and bedroom. Let these be your slogans:

Lie back for your rights! Cook for contentment! Suckle for success! Sew for sanity! Stand by/Lie under/lie for/kowtow to your man!.


That's funny, Tuna!

But how can women get back what they never gave up?



You DO know what my 'in joke' for one person was about? (And it seemed like a good idea at the time. 🗯) Edited. Again.








Sometimes the longest way around is the shortest way home. Anon
almo 1
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 9:49:28 PM
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Location: Fussa, Tokyo, Japan
Hope123 wrote:


You DO know what my 'in joke' for one person was about? (And I am sorry I started it.)







You mean...Pray

Or
you mean...Think




tunaafi
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 9:56:10 PM

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Hope123 wrote:
You DO know what my 'in joke' for one person was about?

Yup.

Quote:
And it seemed like a good idea at the time.

It was.

Far away is close at hand in images of elsewhere – The Master of Paddington.
TMe
Posted: Tuesday, February 21, 2017 11:06:14 PM

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The Parser;



[b]P.S. On the Web, however, there is no problem. If some rude individual posts an insulting remark to you, you can take all the time that you want before replying with the perfect insult in return. I personally, however, never reply to rude netizens. I ignore them.


To ignore the rude is by far the best, peaceful and noble revenge.[b]

Deliberate practice of one hour is worth ten hours of normal practice.
TheParser
Posted: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 5:34:25 AM
Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 9/21/2012
Posts: 3,771
Neurons: 17,862
dave argo wrote:




Thanks for the great explanation.
TheParser
Posted: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 5:36:46 AM
Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 9/21/2012
Posts: 3,771
Neurons: 17,862
TMe wrote:



To ignore the rude is by far the best, peaceful and noble revenge.[b]



Thanks.
tunaafi
Posted: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 6:54:16 AM

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Location: Karlín, Praha, Czech Republic
dave argo wrote:
While on a trip to another European country, I seem to remember a late retort being cleverly compared with a delayed fall of a coin
in the public phone, the click that took too long to connect.

We speakers of BrE say 'The penny dropped' when we realise the full meaning of something that we had not at first first realised.

Far away is close at hand in images of elsewhere – The Master of Paddington.
Andrew Schultz
Posted: Tuesday, March 07, 2017 2:29:34 PM

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The Germans have a word for it, too. Treppenwitz, according to this link I enjoyed: http://www.thebookoflife.org/why-germans-can-say-things-no-one-else-can/ (I didn't know this until now.)

I particularly enjoy the idiom section of this fine website.
Hope123
Posted: Tuesday, March 07, 2017 2:59:39 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 3/23/2015
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Andrew Schultz wrote:
The Germans have a word for it, too. Treppenwitz, according to this link I enjoyed: http://www.thebookoflife.org/why-germans-can-say-things-no-one-else-can/ (I didn't know this until now.)


Andrew - absolutely wonderful! Every one of those words is great. Whoever came up with each one shows a great deal of perspicacity about human psychology and the condition of human life. There's only one I can remember right now so I'd better get memorizing. I have bookmarked the website! Thank you so much. 👍💥🎈👏Applause

Sometimes the longest way around is the shortest way home. Anon
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