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"à l’occurrence frênée" (translation help requested) Options
KMPageau
Posted: Tuesday, April 22, 2014 2:28:18 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/22/2014
Posts: 58
Neurons: 193
Location: Montréal, Quebec, Canada
At around 3 minutes, 30 seconds into this French radio tape online at CBC Archives, the speaker uses the phrase "à l’occurrence frênée". I think I know what it means, but I can't come up with a decent fluid English translation for it.

Source: http://archives.radio-canada.ca/emissions/578-6159/page/10/

My attempted French transcript:

Quote:
Euh – aussi bien dans le mouvement syndical, qui, dans un esprit nettement politique, c’est un phénomène qu’on croit remarquable. Alors, euh – peut-etre le PQ compte implicitement avec une organisation populaire – uh, qui aurait des objectifs beaucoup plus radicaux que ceux des PQ – et que le PQ pourrait encadrer même à l’occurrence frênée.


My attempted English translation:

Quote:
Uh – as well, in the trade union movement, which, in a definitely political spirit, is a quite remarkable phenomenon. So, uh – maybe the PQ is implicitly counting on a popular set-up – uh, which would have goals far more radical than those of the PQ – and to which the PQ could give a framework, even à l’occurrence frênée.


I think that "à l’occurrence frênée" means "at a braked rate of speed", a way of saying that the PQ could in fact start out with its own socialist "manifesto", but slowly gear up towards the far more socialist (communist) approach demanded by these much more radicalized trade unions. But "at a braked rate of speed" isn't very fluid English, and I doubt it really captures what this phrase probably says in the context.

Thanks if you can help with this.
SandraM
Posted: Wednesday, April 23, 2014 5:28:14 AM
Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 3/11/2009
Posts: 399
Neurons: 1,454
KMPageau wrote:
Alors, euh – peut-etre le PQ compte implicitement avec une organisation populaire – uh, qui aurait des objectifs beaucoup plus radicaux que ceux des PQ – et que le PQ pourrait encadrer même à l’occurrence frênée.

I'm hearing "que le PQ pourrait encadrer et même à l'occurrence freiner"
I think here "à l'occurrence" is used where I (French native speaker from France) would use "à l'occasion"=when applicable/when necessary
so the speaker says that the PQ could "encadrer" and even slow down this popular organisation.
KMPageau
Posted: Tuesday, April 29, 2014 2:14:35 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 4/22/2014
Posts: 58
Neurons: 193
Location: Montréal, Quebec, Canada
SandraM wrote:
KMPageau wrote:
Alors, euh – peut-etre le PQ compte implicitement avec une organisation populaire – uh, qui aurait des objectifs beaucoup plus radicaux que ceux des PQ – et que le PQ pourrait encadrer même à l’occurrence frênée.


I'm hearing "que le PQ pourrait encadrer et même à l'occurrence freiner"

I think here "à l'occurrence" is used where I (French native speaker from France) would use "à l'occasion"=when applicable/when necessary

so the speaker says that the PQ could "encadrer" and even slow down this popular organisation.


Sandra, thank you, this is interesting feedback. I want to explain why I am "suspicious" that the statement in question might mean the PQ could slowly become more radical than indicated by the demands in its manifesto.

The PQ, the Parti québécois, was actually set up by René Lévesque on the instructions of about a dozen federal cabinet members in the Lester Pearson government of Canada around 1967, further to regular meetings held by the Liberal Party on the premises of a multinational corporation in downtown Montreal.

Every one of those cabinet members was Far Left, some were specifically pro-Soviet and had been behind the Iron Curtain more than once; they had all militated in a very consistent way in Montreal through the 1950s and early 60s for socialism.

Some of them went directly into the trade unions to secularize them, and to teach courses in Marxism and socialism, to encourage quite radical views. I am fairly sure that the even more 'radical' demands of these trade unions, at the time of the 1972 manifesto, can be explained by this penetration of the Far Left into the trade unions in the previous 15-20 years.

Those members of the Far Left who had led this revolutionary movement in the trade unions and elsewhere, then took up politics and ran for office. Now, they have placed themselves in a position to use the levers of politics to "answer", i.e., "grant" the demands for socialism which they, themselves created.

Three of these people in particular had previously belonged to the openly socialist NDP, which could not get itself elected. No doubt because their platform is opposed to the ownership of private property -- then, as now. They therefore decided to jump aboard the (covertly Leftist) Liberals, and lo and behold, they were elected.

Then, from their new positions in the federal cabinet, it seems to me they set out to "answer" the demands of the trade unions, demands which they themselves had largely created by penetrating the trade unions and other groups before they entered politics.

Now that they are in politics, and in government, I suspect these Liberals -- who in fact ordained the creation of the "separatist" Parti Québécois as a vehicle to give themselves an excuse to "negotiate" more and more socialism for all of Canada with their own allies who were already in place to "negotiate" with them -- would be likely to want somehow to escalate the PQ platform to meet the more radical demands of the trade unions.

Your understanding of "l'occurrence" may well be the right one; I'm just suspicious, because I know something of what these people were up to before the PQ was set up. I think they would like to go more radical, if they could, if they had an excuse; and I suspect the trade unions could give them that excuse.

My suspicions may be essentially right; however, that doesn't necessarily mean that this is what they have said here. They may have well said what your good ear has suggested: "que le PQ pourrait encadrer et même à l'occurrence freiner".

Maybe my suspicions will trigger some additional ideas as to what is being said.

Thanks very much for your help, really appreciate it.












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