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Oscar D. Grouch
Posted: Thursday, September 26, 2019 9:35:22 PM

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taurine
Posted: Friday, September 27, 2019 3:42:44 AM

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Joined: 4/20/2016
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Location: South Dublin, Ireland
Expense, and afterthought, and idle care,
And doubts of motley hue, and dark despair;
Suspicions, and fantastical surmise;
And jealousy, suffused with jaundice in her eyes,
Discolouring all she viewed, in tawny dressed,
Down looked, and with a cuckoo on her fist.

-Dryden Fables

Sas? Nic. Sassnitz. Rug, ja? Rugen. Telemark in Harzgerode.
Oscar D. Grouch
Posted: Sunday, September 29, 2019 9:15:14 PM

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Oscar D. Grouch
Posted: Monday, October 7, 2019 11:20:21 AM

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FounDit
Posted: Monday, October 7, 2019 6:33:11 PM

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When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, tliat the dunces are all in confederacy against him.

~Jonathan Swift~



We should look to the past to learn from it, not destroy our future because of it — FounDit
Lotje1000
Posted: Tuesday, October 8, 2019 1:52:14 AM

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“Who is more foolish? The fool or the fool who follows him?”

― Obi Wan Kenobi
BobShilling
Posted: Tuesday, October 8, 2019 7:11:26 AM
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Lotje1000 wrote:
“Who is more foolish? The fool or the fool who follows him?”

The problem facing the USA at the moment, as I see it, is not Trump, but the Republican Party.

People knew pretty well what Trump was when they elected him. They should have known of his distinct failures (and propensity to boast about his 'successes'), so can't have been too surprised at his failure achieve some of his main promises (even when Republicans had a majority in both Houses): to build a wall at Mexico's expense, to destroy Obamacare, to drain the swamp, etc.

What has become increasingly clear since he was elected is his complete ignorance of and/or total disregard for, the Constitution. I find it very disturbing that, so long as Trump spouts the words that Republicans politicians hoping to remain in or to gain positions of power think will enable them to achieve their ends, they are happy, or at least most of them are, to turn a blind eye to this.
Hope123
Posted: Tuesday, October 8, 2019 9:45:33 AM

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When I took over our military, we did not have ammunition. I was told by a top general, maybe the top of them all, 'Sir, I'm sorry sir, we don't have ammunition.' I said, I will never let that happen to another president." Donald J. Trump

As I have stated strongly before, and just to reiterate, if Turkey does anything that I, in my great and unmatched wisdom, consider to be off limits, I will totally destroy and obliterate the Economy of Turkey (I’ve done before!). They must, with Europe and others, watch over... Donald J. Trump


Thank you Prime Minister Erdogan for joining us yesterday to celebrate the launch of Trump Towers, Istanbul. Ivanka Trump

Edited to add: I don’t know why so many Republicans are so bent out of shape by Trump’s statement about doublecrossing the Kurds.

Clearly, he’s not “serious”.

It’s the media’s fault for believing anything he says is the policy of the United States, right?

Right?
Chris Murphy, Senator from Connecticut

"The louder he talked of his honor, the faster we counted our spoons." Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)
towan52
Posted: Tuesday, October 8, 2019 9:55:55 AM

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FounDit wrote:
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, tliat the dunces are all in confederacy against him.

~Jonathan Swift~



So Captain Sphincter Blossom is the new Messiah?

Voldermort for Trump 2020
Hope123
Posted: Tuesday, October 8, 2019 10:17:55 AM

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Hope123
Posted: Tuesday, October 8, 2019 6:35:33 PM

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Trump just declared himself above the law and above the constitution.

While claiming that the constitutional impeachment process is... unconstitutional.


It's a shame nobody, not even Hillary, warned America that Trump wanted to be a dictator. Especially when during a debate with Hillary he said he might not concede if he lost the election. Whistle Whistle Whistle

"The louder he talked of his honor, the faster we counted our spoons." Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)
FounDit
Posted: Tuesday, October 8, 2019 8:21:11 PM

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FounDit wrote:
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him.

~Jonathan Swift~




And if you needed proof, you have herewith been presented with an abundance.


We should look to the past to learn from it, not destroy our future because of it — FounDit
Lotje1000
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 2:44:10 AM

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"So this is how liberty dies... with thunderous applause."

- Padmé Amidala
March Hare
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 6:58:45 AM

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"The most tragic thing in the world is a man of genius who is not a man of honor."

― George Bernard Shaw
Hope123
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 9:33:30 AM

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Not having the American POV, I don't get it. Oscar, why do they need all those whistleblowers when Trump has admitted he did it and now has moved the goal post to say it was not wrong? It should be an open and shut case. So many weird things have happened in US politics, and not just since Trump.

Article explains how what is happening now all comes back to Russia.

https://www.newsandguts.com/trump-ukraine-scandal-it-always-comes-back-to-russia/

Trump is in contempt of Congress. Congress can itself arrest and jail individuals until they testify or provide documents.

But with William Barr, who was cited in contempt himself, being in Trump's pocket, what would be next?



"The louder he talked of his honor, the faster we counted our spoons." Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)
Hope123
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 9:35:16 AM

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Location: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Lotje1000 wrote:
“Who is more foolish? The fool or the fool who follows him?”

― Obi Wan Kenobi


Applause Applause Applause

"The louder he talked of his honor, the faster we counted our spoons." Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)
Hope123
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 9:59:53 AM

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Location: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
March Hare wrote:
"The most tragic thing in the world is a man of genius who is not a man of honor."

― George Bernard Shaw



True. Whether genius or not, honour is always more important!

But what do we mean by "genius" or "intelligence"?

What we mean by “intelligent” or “genius” ultimately depends on the kind of proof we look for. There is emotional intelligence as well as mental agility intelligence. Geniuses are not noted for emotional or even social intelligence.

Republicans have pretty much always liked swagger, and non-bookish rich popular celebrities they think have "guts" and persuasiveness, like Hollywood actor Ronald Reagan and the proud C-student and baseball team owner George W. Bush, while they overlook the ineptitude and ignorance. They accuse the kind of people Democrats like of being pretentious.

Democrats like technical expertise and educated people who make deliberated decisions that are driven by science. Democrats chose the U.S. Naval Academy-educated engineer Jimmy Carter, the Rhodes Scholar Bill Clinton, the Harvard-trained lawyer Barack Obama. They accuse the Republican choices of being inept..


"The louder he talked of his honor, the faster we counted our spoons." Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)
FounDit
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 11:56:56 AM

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I can't help but wonder how all the hatred, contempt and divisiveness serves those who embrace it. I'm particularly thinking of the Democrats and Republicans here in the U.S., because the opinions of those in other countries don't really carry any influence or weight, since they don't get to vote.

The Democrats lost an election. Okay. So why all the hate and divisiveness? It's not like it hasn't happened before, or do they believe they can never win again? It seems that is the case. But that would then seem like a good motivation to change ideas for ones that more people would support, rather than to double-down on hate and division.

Furthermore, those who drive the impulses for hate and division will not cease, even if they win. History shows that the anger and rage does not diminish, but after winning, when there is no one left to attack, the leaders of that hate and rage eventually turn on the very people who gave them their victory. It's a very curious thing.

I wonder that those who allow themselves to feel such hate don't seem to recognize they are being manipulated to their own detriment, for if hate and division are permitted to run its full course, those who relish them will eventually destroy the very thing they say they want to improve - the country. But perhaps that is the true goal in the end. But it will be a Pyrrhic victory.


"I think we won"

~Gahan Wilson~



We should look to the past to learn from it, not destroy our future because of it — FounDit
Oscar D. Grouch
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 12:42:46 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 6/26/2014
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Hope123 wrote:
Not having the American POV, I don't get it. Oscar, why do they need all those whistleblowers when Trump has admitted he did it and now has moved the goal post to say it was not wrong? It should be an open and shut case. So many weird things have happened in US politics, and not just since Trump.


Agreed. The CIA should just kidnap little donny and airdrop him into the middle of the African Savanna.
towan52
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 12:47:10 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

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Location: Waco, Texas, United States
Good points FD although not sure about premise that the invective is due to losing the 2016 election. More about what CSB has done since.

You know if you'd just paid the damn stamp duty and sworn fealty to the king back in 1770s, none of this would have arisen. We could all be sharing in the serenity and accord currently so evident in the British parliament ... Oh! - just a sec!!!! Whistle

Voldermort for Trump 2020
Romany
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 12:51:52 PM
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As Thar said on another thread - watching people continuing to try to defend Trump now is just 'sad'.

As for the opinions of the rest of the world not carrying any "influence" or "weight"? A child, who has no idea of a) their own place in the world or b)hasn't even a simple understanding of how the world works, might get away with that sort of statement - while all the grown-ups pat his head and smile brightly through their embarrassment.

But adults honestly giving voice to a thought like that is...yep!...sad.
Romany
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 12:57:14 PM
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Towan -

But hey, keep in mind that while the whole of Europe might be down on us - they don't have a vote in the UK, so that's all right, then!
Hope123
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 6:40:58 PM

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Location: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
FounDit, it is hard to reconcile the reasonable post you just wrote about the damage done by hatred and divisiveness in the US with previous rants you've posted about Liberals in general. Also you seem to condone, by ignoring and not denouncing, the invective spewed by your president every single day, and especially at rallies. He actually encourages/hints that the right violence will be condoned, or that pardons are forthcoming for his cronies.

Is it just a lack of awareness that you do do not see that disconnect and also see the fact that you had to specifically spell it out once again that you think posters who disagree with you on this thread are dunces is also promoting discord? We got the implication in the first post just as you got the fool's one in repartee but they were general at first, not directed at posters personally till your next post.

It has been pointed out to you many times that democrats have moved on from anger at the election loss to anger at what Trump is doing. I understand why Trump uses the election as an excuse so he doesn't have to face up to the fact they don't like him and what he is doing, but surely you can see past that?

BTW, there is no need to point out once again that non Americans have no say in the matter as they are well aware that your president is disrupting their lives, even shortening them (as the Kurd allies now know), and they have not even the control of one vote.


Link showing how this has been going on in US long before 2015 election:

https://www.people-press.org/2014/06/12/political-polarization-in-the-american-public/

"The louder he talked of his honor, the faster we counted our spoons." Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)
Hope123
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 6:48:50 PM

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Location: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Romany wrote:
Towan -

But hey, keep in mind that while the whole of Europe might be down on us - they don't have a vote in the UK, so that's all right, then!


Romany, Europe may be down on you because the UK is affecting their lives too, but the rest of the democratic world is pulling for both the UK and Europe to get this sorted.

Edited - and soon!

"The louder he talked of his honor, the faster we counted our spoons." Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)
Hope123
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 9:44:11 PM

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This just gets better and better.

https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/articles/2019-10-09/trump-urged-top-aide-to-help-giuliani-client-facing-doj-charges?__twitter_impression=true

"The louder he talked of his honor, the faster we counted our spoons." Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)
Hope123
Posted: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 10:10:07 PM

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Joined: 3/23/2015
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Location: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Now it gets really worse - Horrible breaking news - National Security Correspondent for Fox News Jennifer Griffin says "US military has been ordered by Trump not to help" even though Syrian Kurds under bombardment from Turkish jets urgently request air support from U.S. and “No fly zone” to protect civilians: SDF statement.

A lot of the weapons being used by the Turks to invade Syria and assault the Kurds are made in the US. Turkey is now bombing civilians. The genocide has commenced and Trump is on the sidelines pretending not to cheer. All because of two hotels and greed.

I don't know how Trump, Republicans in government who prop him up, and his supporters who keep him in power can sleep at night. There's now even more blood on their hands. I take one person back - Trump doesn't sleep. He also has no idea how others feel.

Spin this FD, how it is just that the dunces are against him.



Written by an American in the know - they are outright calling Trump corrupt.

"For all the talk about President Trump and Russia, there's also Trump and Ukraine, Trump and Turkey, Trump and Saudi Arabia, and likely elsewhere where the shadow of self-interest and corruption eclipses the clarity of our national interest.




"The louder he talked of his honor, the faster we counted our spoons." Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)
FounDit
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 1:10:39 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 9/19/2011
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Neurons: 59,150
Romany wrote:
As Thar said on another thread - watching people continuing to try to defend Trump now is just 'sad'.

As for the opinions of the rest of the world not carrying any "influence" or "weight"? A child, who has no idea of a) their own place in the world or b)hasn't even a simple understanding of how the world works, might get away with that sort of statement - while all the grown-ups pat his head and smile brightly through their embarrassment.

But adults honestly giving voice to a thought like that is...yep!...sad.


Well, do enlighten us all, please. As an "adult", perhaps you could educate this "child" on exactly how much "influence" and "weight" your opinion has on what happens here in the U.S.
I, for one, would really be interested in knowing. I'm looking forward to your answer.


We should look to the past to learn from it, not destroy our future because of it — FounDit
FounDit
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 1:38:16 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

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Hope123 wrote:
FounDit, it is hard to reconcile the reasonable post you just wrote about the damage done by hatred and divisiveness in the US with previous rants you've posted about Liberals in general. Also you seem to condone, by ignoring and not denouncing, the invective spewed by your president every single day, and especially at rallies. He actually encourages/hints that the right violence will be condoned, or that pardons are forthcoming for his cronies.
I don't believe I've ever heard him say any of the things you accuse him of saying. I've not heard invective "every single day", not at rallies. Neither have I heard him condone violence. As for pardons, if they were falsely convicted, or if the sentences weren't just, I have no problem with that. Also, I don't "rant", I make observations.

Is it just a lack of awareness that you do do not see that disconnect and also see the fact that you had to specifically spell it out once again that you think posters who disagree with you on this thread are dunces is also promoting discord? We got the implication in the first post just as you got the fool's one in repartee but they were general at first, not directed at posters personally till your next post.
I wasn't thinking of posters in my first post. I was thinking of the Democrats and Republicans that hate the President, but if the shoe fits...

It has been pointed out to you many times that democrats have moved on from anger at the election loss to anger at what Trump is doing. I understand why Trump uses the election as an excuse so he doesn't have to face up to the fact they don't like him and what he is doing, but surely you can see past that?
Now who is disconnected? The Democrats haven't moved an inch from their anger over the election loss. Hillary was just on TV tonight still complaining about it. Everything the Democrats have done since that election has been motivated by their anger over that loss. How do you not see that?

BTW, there is no need to point out once again that non Americans have no say in the matter as they are well aware that your president is disrupting their lives, even shortening them (as the Kurd allies now know), and they have not even the control of one vote.
He is looking out for our lives, for Americans, which is exactly what he should be doing. But feel free to inform us along with Romany on how much influence and weight your opinion has on what happens here in the U.S. It should be informative.


Link showing how this has been going on in US long before 2015 election:

https://www.people-press.org/2014/06/12/political-polarization-in-the-american-public/

The issue isn't polarization, it is the degree to which it has risen since the Democrat loss in 2016.



We should look to the past to learn from it, not destroy our future because of it — FounDit
Lotje1000
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 2:56:45 AM

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"Your focus determines your reality"
- Qui-gon Jinn
Hope123
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 10:54:36 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 3/23/2015
Posts: 8,878
Neurons: 50,866
Location: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
FounDit wrote:
Hope123 wrote:
FounDit, it is hard to reconcile the reasonable post you just wrote about the damage done by hatred and divisiveness in the US with previous rants you've posted about Liberals in general. Also you seem to condone, by ignoring and not denouncing, the invective spewed by your president every single day, and especially at rallies. He actually encourages/hints that the right violence will be condoned, or that pardons are forthcoming for his cronies.
I don't believe I've ever heard him say any of the things you accuse him of saying. I've not heard invective "every single day", not at rallies. Neither have I heard him condone violence. As for pardons, if they were falsely convicted, or if the sentences weren't just, I have no problem with that. Also, I don't "rant", I make observations.


Answers in green.

I don't know where to start with this one.

If you haven't heard it, as Lotje's quote indicates you're listening only to your focus. And your memory is not as good as mine re earlier writing in an angry and emotionally charged manner, especially during the campaign.

There are so many lists of Trump's insults to over 600 people that some are listed alphabetically. Several tweets daily. Videos of nasty things said to journalists, especially women and women of colour. Promising pardons to guilty people to save your own skin is not the same as pardoning innocent people.

He has openly encouraged or supported violence against his opponents, critics and media.There are many times he has hinted at violence such as against Hillary during the campaign, and then he uses plausible deniability.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/03/14/trump-again-nods-toward-violence-by-his-supporters-maybe-something-bigger/

Here are just three where he encourages violence outright.

“If you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of them, would you? Seriously, okay? Just knock the hell … I promise you I will pay for the legal fees. I promise, I promise,” he said. Of a heckler: “He’s walking out with big high-fives, smiling, laughing. I’d like to punch him in the face, I’ll tell you. Less than two weeks later, Trump repeated his legal-fees promise to those taking a protester out of a rally in Warren, Mich., saying: “Get him out. Try not to hurt him. If you do, I’ll defend you in court, don’t worry about it.””


Words matter - especially those of someone with Trump's power!


Is it just a lack of awareness that you do do not see that disconnect and also see the fact that you had to specifically spell it out once again that you think posters who disagree with you on this thread are dunces is also promoting discord? We got the implication in the first post just as you got the fool's one in repartee but they were general at first, not directed at posters personally till your next post.
I wasn't thinking of posters in my first post. I was thinking of the Democrats and Republicans that hate the President, but if the shoe fits...


I already said we knew the first post was not for posters. It was the second one.

It has been pointed out to you many times that democrats have moved on from anger at the election loss to anger at what Trump is doing. I understand why Trump uses the election as an excuse so he doesn't have to face up to the fact they don't like him and what he is doing, but surely you can see past that?
Now who is disconnected? The Democrats haven't moved an inch from their anger over the election loss. Hillary was just on TV tonight still complaining about it. Everything the Democrats have done since that election has been motivated by their anger over that loss. How do you not see that?


How do you not see that it is Trump who brings up Hillary all the time, especially on Twitter and still prompts rallies to chant "Lock her up". This time she was responding to his tweet when she said "Don't tempt me to run again." Republicans have been talking about opening investigations into her emails recently! Besides she's only one person and only a civilian now.

You and Trump and Republicans need to forget about Hillary.

Nancy Pelosi is the Democrat directing the discussion and she talks about what is happening now with Trump's policies and how they can't get any of their many initiatives to help the people through Mitch McConnell. About how Trump is breaking many laws. Schumer and Schiff too. The only election they are thinking about is 2020.



BTW, there is no need to point out once again that non Americans have no say in the matter as they are well aware that your president is disrupting their lives, even shortening them (as the Kurd allies now know), and they have not even the control of one vote.
He is looking out for our lives, for Americans, which is exactly what he should be doing. But feel free to inform us along with Romany on how much influence and weight your opinion has on what happens here in the U.S. It should be informative.


You missed the point - that's the problem - we have no influence except to support the majority of American citizens who in recent polls want him impeached and removed from office. Many Canadians and Brits do so daily on Twitter and other formats.

Many Americans do not feel "helped". Especially the special American forces with the Kurds who say they feel betrayed. The farmers, the manufacturers, citizens paying more for everything because of tariffs. etc. Even Fox News is having trouble supporting him as usual, and Trump now says "they suck".


Link showing how this has been going on in US long before 2015 election:

https://www.people-press.org/2014/06/12/political-polarization-in-the-american-public/

The issue isn't polarization, it is the degree to which it has risen since the Democrat loss in 2016.



Two things happened in 2016. Democrats lost. Trump rose to power that he is trying to increase by controlling the DOJ and media.

So you really mean the increase in hatred all over the world since Trump, the president of the United States, condones it. The rest of the world doesn't care about the election loss, only what Trump does now.


"The louder he talked of his honor, the faster we counted our spoons." Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)
FounDit
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 4:05:40 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 9/19/2011
Posts: 11,823
Neurons: 59,150
Hope123 wrote:
FounDit wrote:
Hope123 wrote:
FounDit, it is hard to reconcile the reasonable post you just wrote about the damage done by hatred and divisiveness in the US with previous rants you've posted about Liberals in general. Also you seem to condone, by ignoring and not denouncing, the invective spewed by your president every single day, and especially at rallies. He actually encourages/hints that the right violence will be condoned, or that pardons are forthcoming for his cronies.
I don't believe I've ever heard him say any of the things you accuse him of saying. I've not heard invective "every single day", not at rallies. Neither have I heard him condone violence. As for pardons, if they were falsely convicted, or if the sentences weren't just, I have no problem with that. Also, I don't "rant", I make observations.


Answers in green.
FounDit: Answers in Red.

I don't know where to start with this one.

If you haven't heard it, as Lotje's quote indicates you're listening only to your focus. And your memory is not as good as mine re earlier writing in an angry and emotionally charged manner, especially during the campaign.
You may be right, here, because I have no memory of being angry and emotionally charged during the campaign.

There are so many lists of Trump's insults to over 600 people that some are listed alphabetically. Several tweets daily. Videos of nasty things said to journalists, especially women and women of colour. Promising pardons to guilty people to save your own skin is not the same as pardoning innocent people.
Insults are violence? In that case, Trump has been assaulted thousands of times more than he has done to others. And if saying nasty things are violence, then all of you here are guilty of it also.

He has openly encouraged or supported violence against his opponents, critics and media.There are many times he has hinted at violence such as against Hillary during the campaign, and then he uses plausible deniability.
No! Really? He hinted? How horrible!

Here are just three where he encourages violence outright.

“If you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of them, would you? Seriously, okay? Just knock the hell … I promise you I will pay for the legal fees. I promise, I promise,” he said. Of a heckler: “He’s walking out with big high-fives, smiling, laughing. I’d like to punch him in the face, I’ll tell you. Less than two weeks later, Trump repeated his legal-fees promise to those taking a protester out of a rally in Warren, Mich., saying: “Get him out. Try not to hurt him. If you do, I’ll defend you in court, don’t worry about it.””

So if someone is about to throw something at the President, he commits violence if he asks another to stop them, right? So it's violence to ask someone to stop violent behavior. Uh, huh.

And it was the protester who was swinging his fists and hitting people at the rally. He was the one committing violence. Yet when the President asks them to remove him, but not to hurt him, he is committing violence.

Words matter - especially those of someone with Trump's power!
Only his words matter? Others can say horrible things and that's okay with you? Uh, huh.

Is it just a lack of awareness that you do do not see that disconnect and also see the fact that you had to specifically spell it out once again that you think posters who disagree with you on this thread are dunces is also promoting discord? We got the implication in the first post just as you got the fool's one in repartee but they were general at first, not directed at posters personally till your next post.
I wasn't thinking of posters in my first post. I was thinking of the Democrats and Republicans that hate the President, but if the shoe fits...


I already said we knew the first post was not for posters. It was the second one.
But you all provided the evidence, just as you are doing here with these silly and illogical arguments.

It has been pointed out to you many times that democrats have moved on from anger at the election loss to anger at what Trump is doing. A lie. I understand why Trump uses the election as an excuse so he doesn't have to face up to the fact they don't like him and what he is doing, but surely you can see past that?
Actually, it is the very opposite. The Democrats are using the loss of the election as a basis for all that they are doing in trying to destroy him and his Presidency.

Now who is disconnected? The Democrats haven't moved an inch from their anger over the election loss. Hillary was just on TV tonight still complaining about it. Everything the Democrats have done since that election has been motivated by their anger over that loss. How do you not see that?


How do you not see that it is Trump who brings up Hillary all the time, especially on Twitter and still prompts rallies to chant "Lock her up". This time she was responding to his tweet when she said "Don't tempt me to run again." Republicans have been talking about opening investigations into her emails recently! Besides she's only one person and only a civilian now.

You and Trump and Republicans need to forget about Hillary.
I would be happy to do so but she needs to answer for so much corruption that she has engaged in, that it wouldn't be proper to let her slide on that.

Nancy Pelosi is the Democrat directing the discussion and she talks about what is happening now with Trump's policies and how they can't get any of their many initiatives to help the people through Mitch McConnell. About how Trump is breaking many laws. Schumer and Schiff too. The only election they are thinking about is 2020.

Pelosi has lost control of her Party, and the Dems have no desire to do anything that would make Trump look good, especially actually doing their job as legislators, passing laws that would help the public.

BTW, there is no need to point out once again that non Americans have no say in the matter as they are well aware that your president is disrupting their lives, even shortening them (as the Kurd allies now know), and they have not even the control of one vote.
He is looking out for our lives, for Americans, which is exactly what he should be doing. But feel free to inform us along with Romany on how much influence and weight your opinion has on what happens here in the U.S. It should be informative.

Have you heard of the PKK?

You missed the point - that's the problem - we have no influence except to support the majority of American citizens who in recent polls want him impeached and removed from office. Many Canadians and Brits do so daily on Twitter and other formats.
Well, you can wish all you like, but again, none of the opinions of people who can't vote have any influence or weight at all. He isn't going to be impeached or removed.

Many Americans do not feel "helped". Especially the special American forces with the Kurds who say they feel betrayed. The farmers, the manufacturers, citizens paying more for everything because of tariffs. etc. Even Fox News is having trouble supporting him as usual, and Trump now says "they suck".

As I have said before, there will always be weak-minded people who will complain about their lives as victims of one thing or another.

Link showing how this has been going on in US long before 2015 election:

https://www.people-press.org/2014/06/12/political-polarization-in-the-american-public/

The issue isn't polarization, it is the degree to which it has risen since the Democrat loss in 2016.



Two things happened in 2016. Democrats lost. Trump rose to power that he is trying to increase by controlling the DOJ and media.
Um, Hello! The DOJ is under the control of the Executive Branch of government. That is part of the President's job description. And if you think Trump has control of the media, that dunce hat will fit you perfectly.

So you really mean the increase in hatred all over the world since Trump, the president of the United States, condones it. The rest of the world doesn't care about the election loss, only what Trump does now.

Say what?! Trump condones the increased hatred all over the world that is being directed at him? I think that hat just got a little tighter.



We should look to the past to learn from it, not destroy our future because of it — FounDit
Hope123
Posted: Thursday, October 10, 2019 10:41:42 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 3/23/2015
Posts: 8,878
Neurons: 50,866
Location: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Whatever, FD. Write it all off as silly and illogical as you defend the indefensible with semantics.

And by just ignoring the parts that prove my point - Trump said, "Knock the hell...I'd like to punch him in the face...I'll defend you in court...I'll pay your legal fees". This is encouragement for physical contact.

You say you haven't heard invective by your president, I give you examples, and you twist it that insults are not violence. I mention how he suggests/hints at violence and you dismiss them as inconsequential. Normal people may be able to brush off Trump's hyperbole, but unstable ones can't - and some just don't want to. Lawyers for Trump's 'Super Fan' said Trump's rhetoric inspired the Terrorist bomb-sending plot against Democrats and the media. There are many other shooters around the world who named Trump as inspiration. Trump gives a nod in a tweet to someone who disagrees with him or competes with him and shortly thereafter his followers overwhelm the target with death threats.

FounDit wrote: "And if saying nasty things are violence, then all of you here are guilty of it also."

Who is saying that saying nasty things are violence? You are the one who brought that up.

Besides, I skimmed the thread again and see only two names you might call insults that are not particularly nasty of Trump in this whole thread - "little donny" and "Captain Sphincter Blossom". The rest is truth and the criticism is not said nastily. I see where a comment of yours, not his, was called childish and Romany has a right to her opinion about your statement. A children's singsong actually came to my mind as I read that statement that you've said before. In fact the only real (attempted) insults in the whole thread were your continuation of your "dunce" theme three times.

I think it was McConnell who said on TV he would make Obama a one term president and tried to destroy his presidency. Where was your outrage then? Plus I didn't hear Obama accuse Republicans of not being able to get over the election. He just went on doing his job. After all the investigations of Hillary since the 1990s that turned up nothing, she's a private citizen, and you still want her to answer for some thing you have no proof of. I'd like to see GW Bush answer for starting a war that has had serious consequences for the world but... As for Pelosi, she actually has a list of bills Dems have passed in what she calls "McConnell's graveyard".

Unfortunately all political figures get ridiculed and insulted, often unfairly, but I have never ever seen any president cry and whine about it, calling it harassment daily - and it IS daily - on Twitter. Check for yourself. I would have no idea Obama got the most death threats of any president if I hadn't stumbled upon it online.

In Trump's case he gets what he gives.

If I were to do his favourite past time of insulting name calling of anyone who opposes him, it would have something to do with the constant in Trump's life - betrayal.

He has betrayed his revolving-door White House staff, the DOJ who wouldn't do his bidding, his business partners, his customers, his employees, his friends, his wives, people with more melanin, his constituents who are not his followers, and all the ex US allies.

US and Russia vote against allies in UN meeting re Turkey:

PKK - https://www.vox.com/world/2019/10/9/20906239/turkey-invades-syria-trump-erdogan-kurds


One thing I am afraid you are right about - he will not be impeached or removed from office. He has made the Republicans, his supposed own party, too scared for their jobs to speak up.

BTW - "The President has ultimate power and responsibility for law enforcement and intelligence while at the same time recognizing that in certain matters, the Executive branch needs internal divisions of authority that achieve a type of independence from presidential control." From a law website.

If my truthful criticism of a man such as Trump puts me in the dunce corner, I will proudly sit there with my head held high. As long as I can have my iPad on my lap of course. Angel


"The louder he talked of his honor, the faster we counted our spoons." Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)
Lotje1000
Posted: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:41:54 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 11/3/2014
Posts: 1,071
Neurons: 581,988
Location: Leuven, Flanders, Belgium
Today's examples of the "Tu quoque" fallacy:

FounDit wrote:
Insults are violence? In that case, Trump has been assaulted thousands of times more than he has done to others. And if saying nasty things are violence, then all of you here are guilty of it also.
Only [Trump's] words matter? Others can say horrible things and that's okay with you? Uh, huh.
I would be happy to do so but [Hillary] needs to answer for so much corruption that she has engaged in, that it wouldn't be proper to let her slide on that.
FounDit
Posted: Friday, October 11, 2019 1:54:53 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 9/19/2011
Posts: 11,823
Neurons: 59,150
I'm shooting so far over their heads, they don't even know they've been fired at. *sheesh*...d'oh!

We should look to the past to learn from it, not destroy our future because of it — FounDit
Lotje1000
Posted: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:18:01 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 11/3/2014
Posts: 1,071
Neurons: 581,988
Location: Leuven, Flanders, Belgium
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent." - Qui-Gon Jinn
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