The Free Dictionary  
mailing list For webmasters
Welcome Guest Forum Search | Active Topics | Members

Active and Passive Voice of All Tenses Options
A cooperator
Posted: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 7:13:44 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 10/27/2011
Posts: 2,691
Neurons: 9,658
Location: Ḩāḑírah, Hadramawt, Yemen
Hi Everyone!

I know that English have 12 active affirmative forms tenses of an ordinary English verb. I really couldn't master them and still confused them since my Arabic language has only three tenses(simple future, simple present, and simple past).

Simple future(will+ infinitive), future continuous(will be...ing), future perfect(will have + past participle), futur perfect continuous(will have been ...ing)

Simple present(infinitive, but '-s' on third preson singular), present continuous(am/are/is ...ing), present perfect(have/has + past participle), present perfect continous(have/has been ...ing)
Simple past(regular verbs: infnitive + -(e)d), past continuous(awas/were...ing), past perfect(had + past participle), past perfect contiuous(had been ing)

However, future progressive passives(will be being + pp), future perfect progressive passive(will have been being + pp), present perfect progressive passive(has been being +pp), and past perfect progressive passive(had been being + pp) are unusual.

My questions are:
Firstly: I never ever heard a speaker speaking with "The passive voice of present perfect continuous" in daily conversation. My mouth is not going well while speaking "This house has been being built for years."

Secondly: Which passive voice would a native speaker say, and why?
1- They shoot at me! (Simple present)
I am shot at! (The passive voice of simple present)

2- They are shooting at me! (Present continuous)
I am being shot at! (The passive voice of the present continuous)

3-They have shot at me! (Present perfect)
I have been shot at! (The passive voice of the present perfect)

4- They have been shotting at me !(present perfect continuous. But, this sentence has no present perfect continuous, because it's not a continuous action!)
I've been being shot at!(The passive voice of the present perfect continuous) This is the only way to express the continuous action in present perfect (continuous)!

5- They shot at me! (Simple past )
I was shot at! (The passive voice of the past)

6- They were shooting at me!(The past continuous)
I was being shot at me!(The passive voice of the past continuous)

7- They had shot at me! (The past perfect)
I had been shot at! (The passive voice of the past perfect)

8- The had been shooting at me!(The past perfect contiuous)
I had been being shot at! (The passive voice of the past perfect contiuous)



Finally: If I want to compose my own sentence below, then which passive voice would I use, I can use the passive voice of the past perfect continuous:
I heard about the bad situations/actions which have been being done in Sana'a since Ali Abdullah Saleh was killed.
The bad situations/actions have been being done in Sana'a since Ali Abdullah Saleh was killed.

Whoever doesn't own what he promises to those who do not deserve must not promise it.
thar
Posted: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 7:40:16 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 7/8/2010
Posts: 16,328
Neurons: 65,355
The point really is not what you can say. It is what you want to say.

You use a tense and voice to express a particular meaning.
Which one you choose depends entirely on the context and what you want to say.

The same with the passive - it exists for a reason, to express meaning.
It depends which subject you want to focus attention on, and whether you care about who is performing the action.

For example, if I am dodging bullets, I am more concerned about myself - I am being shot at.
But if I am worried about what other people are doing, I would say they are shooting at me.

That is the point of using them - to express meaning. There is not right or wrong answer - it is all in the context.

And sometimes there is just a better way of saying it.
You would not say 'this house has been being built for two years.'
You would say 'this house has been under construction for two years'. That is nothing to do with the choice of tenses, simply how clearly the idea is expressed - and that many auxiliaries are not a way of expressing anything clearly.

As for tenses - they are built upon each other. So they are not lots of different tenses, just a combination of three basic times.
The thing people unused to tenses get wrong is that they think they are about when something happens.
That is not really true. They are about the time you are viewing it from, and the time of the action. They are all relative to a point in time. If you keep that in mind, they will start to make more sense.
A cooperator
Posted: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 9:10:29 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 10/27/2011
Posts: 2,691
Neurons: 9,658
Location: Ḩāḑírah, Hadramawt, Yemen
thar wrote:
The point really is not what you can say. It is what you want to say.

You use a tense and voice to express a particular meaning.
Which one you choose depends entirely on the context and what you want to say.

The same with the passive - it exists for a reason, to express meaning.
It depends which subject you want to focus attention on, and whether you care about who is performing the action.

For example, if I am dodging bullets, I am more concerned about myself - I am being shot at.
But if I am worried about what other people are doing, I would say they are shooting at me.

That is the point of using them - to express meaning. There is not right or wrong answer - it is all in the context.


Thanks a lot, Thar,
But, you think that saying "I've been being shot at" is incorrect.

Also, why do you think that I read this sentence "They have been shooting at me !" has no present perfect continuous, because it's not a continuous action!). But, I see that it has a present progressive. Isn't it strange????
I've been being shot at!(The passive voice of the present perfect continuous) This is the only way to express the continuous action in present perfect (continuous)!

If I want to say it in all different passive forms, I can say it.


thar wrote:
Quote:

And sometimes there is just a better way of saying it.
You would not say 'this house has been being built for two years.'
You would say 'this house has been under construction for two years'. That is nothing to do with the choice of tenses, simply how clearly the idea is expressed - and that many auxiliaries are not a way of expressing anything clearly.


But, You have let this sentence 'this house has been under construction for two years' be in present perfect. I think "This house has been being built for years." would also be correct in the passive voice of the present perfect progressive.

Whoever doesn't own what he promises to those who do not deserve must not promise it.
A cooperator
Posted: Saturday, December 16, 2017 11:00:11 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 10/27/2011
Posts: 2,691
Neurons: 9,658
Location: Ḩāḑírah, Hadramawt, Yemen
Hi,
First of all, I tend to keep posting my posts in the relevant threads. So, I think no need to open new thread.
If I could determine in some sentence that past participle is and still used as part of a passive verb, then which passive tense would I use in my statement below, the passive voice of the simple present tense, or the passive voice of the present progressive tense?

As you saw that I could determine that the past participle is used as part of a passive verb in that sentence. But, I don't know why I've been still faced with an issue determining whether a past participle is used as part of a passive verb or an adjective in other sentences.

Whoever doesn't own what he promises to those who do not deserve must not promise it.
Харбин Хэйлунцзян 1
Posted: Sunday, December 17, 2017 2:29:35 AM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 10/13/2015
Posts: 1,273
Neurons: 433,657
Location: Dzerzhinskiy, Moskovskaya, Russia
A cooperator wrote:
But, you think that saying "I've been being shot at" is incorrect.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/learningenglish/grammar/learnit/learnitv119.shtml

Quote:
Generally, we avoid using the continuous form of the passive with the future, present perfect, past perfect and future perfect, although present continuous and past continuous are quite common and sound quite natural in the passive voice.


აბა ყვავებს ვინ დაიჭერს, კარგო? გალიაში ბულბულები ზიან.
Fyfardens
Posted: Sunday, December 17, 2017 3:45:43 AM
Rank: Member

Joined: 12/16/2017
Posts: 244
Neurons: 3,661
A cooperator wrote:
But, you think that saying "I've been being shot at" is incorrect.


It is not incorrect.

It's just that nobody is ever likely to say it.
A cooperator
Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 8:21:21 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 10/27/2011
Posts: 2,691
Neurons: 9,658
Location: Ḩāḑírah, Hadramawt, Yemen
Fyfardens wrote:
A cooperator wrote:
But, you think that saying "I've been being shot at" is incorrect.


It is not incorrect.

It's just that nobody is ever likely to say it.


Hello, Fyfradens
I saw, somewhere on the internet, someone wrote:
The boy plays. (no extra context was there.)

Another reader said it should have been read as:
The boy is playing.

How did the reader claim that it should have been read as he/she said.



Whoever doesn't own what he promises to those who do not deserve must not promise it.
palapaguy
Posted: Tuesday, January 09, 2018 9:38:47 PM

Rank: Advanced Member

Joined: 10/28/2013
Posts: 617
Neurons: 8,112
Location: Calabasas, California, United States
Hello, Fyfradens
I saw, somewhere on the internet, someone wrote:
The boy plays. (no extra context was there.)

Another reader said it should have been read as:
The boy is playing.

How did the reader claim that it should have been read as he/she said.

They are both grammatical. The difference is MEANING as many members have tried to tell you.

You need person-to-person training as ... but I repeat myself.
Users browsing this topic
Guest


Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Main Forum RSS : RSS
Forum Terms and Guidelines. Copyright © 2008-2018 Farlex, Inc. All rights reserved.